Thread: Western Propaganda aka клюква lol

Slaughterhouse-Five (1972)

Дрезден, май 1945-го. Американцы мародерничают. Неожиданно появляются брэйв рашшанз быстрой ездой (гхы-гхы) на харлеях с люльками и шашками ППШ наголо!


Приближаются к незадачливому мародёру.
- I surrender, surrender! (Я сдаюсь, сдаюсь!)


Услышав это, товарищч быстро смекает и кричит боевым товарисчам:
- АМЭРИКАНЕЦ! Быстро, быстро водки!
- Амэриканец! Война кончилась!


Процесс пошёл
- На! Хлебни нэмнощко!


- Женщчины знаещь где?
- I don`t know


И так же внезапно уезжают.
- Будь здоров!

Originally Posted by BappaBa

Slaughterhouse-Five (1972)

Дрезден, май 1945-го. Американцы мародерничают. Неожиданно появляются брэйв рашшанз быстрой ездой (гхы-гхы) на харлеях с люльками и шашками ППШ наголо!

Что-то я не припомню такого у Воннегута.

Originally Posted by it-ogo

Что-то я не припомню такого у Воннегута.

А ты можешь вспомнить хоть одну голливудскую экранизацию, чтоб всё было как в оригинале?

Chuck (2010)

Благодаря тому, что главного злодея четвёртого сезона зовут Алексий Волкофф, там клюква на клюкве сидит и клюквой погоняет.
Вот американские шпионы приезжают в Москву. В кадр "случайно" попадает Родина-Мать.


Тут всё понятно. Шедевр дословного перевода.


На круглом красном значке написано "VOLKOFF промышленности". Именно так переводится на голливудский диалект русского языка "Volkoff industries".


Квартиры. Медведь. Пещера. В принципе, вывеска как вывеска.


Бывал я в театре. В буфет заходил, в туалет тоже хаживал, но в бурлеск театра меня не пустили.


Тут я пас. Может у вас есть версии, что это? Я-то сам не из Москвы...



Ну, и напоследок - самарский диалект русского языка.
- Это било давно, Юрек. Я слышал, клучи у тэбья.
- Клучи? Никак! Волкофф ни дал его ко мне. Я присягаю! Он должен вобрать Антония.
- Спасибо. Ты вездегне был честный ж мужик.


ru_klukva_ru: И снова "Чак".

Originally Posted by BappaBa

Chuck (2010)


Тут всё понятно. Шедевр дословного перевода.

I HATE when languages get butchered by Hollywood in this way. It's unbelievable that they spend MILLIONS making the film, and they can't be bothered to find 1 Russian speaking person to just check their spelling and dodgy translations by Google Translate!

And if they MUST have Russian villains in films, how about hiring REAL Russians...?

Of course, Russia and Russians are not the only victims of this.
I once watched a porn film (reluctantly) where a German person was pretending to be Swedish, apparently that was the norm for a long time. And in old war films, again - perhaps German actors don't WANT to play Germans... but there are 80 million Germans, surely they can find someone suitable.

But in all fairness, Russian films are not much better for portraying Germans.... And the Swedish ambassador in the film "Иван Васильевич меняет профессию"!!

Originally Posted by Hanna

I once watched a porn film (reluctantly) where a German person was pretending to be Swedish

Oh, wow, does that mean that there is a distinguishable difference between German and Swedish people in THOSE kind of movies?

Originally Posted by Hanna

And the Swedish ambassador in the film "Иван Васильевич меняет профессию"!!

Ja, Ja. Кемска волость
What kind of language does he speak in the movie? Is it something close to Swedish?

Захватить молниеносно Великобританию не получилось бы, боюсь, при любом раскладе. Так что всё это больше напоминает бессмысленную игру мускулами. США огорчили Советский Союз до невозможности своими ракетами в Европе, и что было делать? А давайте-ка много-много танков поставим поближе к границам ФРГ! Ну, и увлеклись слегка. Но возможность нападения на Европу всерьёз... смысла в этом не было никакого.
Андропов, вернее всего, был обеспокоен затянувшимся застоем, и хотел бы взбодрить экономику, ну а методы использовал - вполне понятные для коммуниста. До Омска, кстати, особо волна и не дошла. Родители рассказывали, помнится, только байки о Москве: как там людей призывали таки заняться полезным трудом в рабочее время.

Originally Posted by maxmixiv

Захватить молниеносно Великобританию не получилось бы, боюсь, при любом раскладе.

Не факт. Этот вопрос поднимался ещё в годы Второй Мировой. Помнишь про Критскую операцию? Критская операция — Википедия А в тот период, который я описываю, была Фолклендская Война (1982), где тоже воевали за острова.

Originally Posted by maxmixiv

Но возможность нападения на Европу всерьёз... смысла в этом не было никакого.

Понимаешь, я бы, наверное, мог бы изобрести какой-нибудь смысл, но нужно ли это? Я лишь говорю о фактах. Моя интерпретация фактов - нападение готовилось. Любой кто это отрицает должен сначала внятно объяснить - зачем СССР нужно было столько мобильных войск. Какой в этом был смысл? Целый род войск ВДВ плюс ДШВ плюс спецназ. Ты два года учишь десантников, а через 10 лет резерва они уже не так эффективны, их нужно доучивать, переучивать, переводить в пехоту. Насколько проще подготовить пограничников с собаками! Призвал солдат и прикажи охранять важные объекты (типа подземных шахт с ядерными ракетами). Пусть учатся ловить вражеских десантников. Проще, дешевле и надёжнее. И сиди себе спокойно, торгуй Родиной (=продавай сырьё за границу), строй развитой социализм в одной, отдельно взятой стране. Чем не план?

He is essentially speaking German, but in a silly way.
There were some people in the USSR who had Swedish as their mothertongue, so it wouldn't have been impossible to find a local person to play the role!

And as for the porn films... The era of German erotic films was before commercial TV took off. People had to buy or rent the films if they wanted them. The stuff that was available was imported from Germany. I watched a few with my girlfriends, out of curiousity.Those films had a bit of a plot! The difference with normal films was that the acting was worse and when things got hot, they did not cut the scene. It was nothing like what's on some of the cable channels today.

Originally Posted by Hanna

He is essentially speaking German, but in a silly way.
There were some people in the USSR who had Swedish as their mothertongue, so it wouldn't have been impossible to find a local person to play the role!

The film is a comedy, not only does the ambassador speak in a silly way but everything is in a silly way. German words were more recognizable for a Soviet viewer, so it increased the comic effect.
Real Swedish would have given nothing.

Oh, here is another really spooky type of propaganda against Russia - religious propaganda!

Some Christians, mainly in the USA, believe that Russia would invade and attempt to obliterate Israel. The reason is that there is a rather complicated Bible prophecy about Israel being invaded by an enemy that fulfills certain criteria that Russia nominally fulfills. This would be part of a series of events around the end of the world as predicted by the Bible.

The idea was particularly strong in the days of the Cold War - a type of propaganda aimed at religious people, I guess. Or is it perfectly legitimate Bible interpretention? Christians elsewhere don't believe it though.

Many American Christians believe that modern Russia still fills all the criteria to fulfill this role. Since Iran is not popular with the USA at the moment, Iran plays a bigger role in this prophecy nowadays. In Cold War days, the main idea was the the USSR was the culprit.

I think the latest version of this idea is that Russia, Kazakhstan, Syria and Iran are involved in this conspiracy. Another thing I picked up was that Russia would be a part of "the one world government of the Antichrist".

Lots of preachers are actually preaching this to their congregations. Personally I don't think there is any point in trying to interpret scripture in this way, and I have to wonder about motivations of those who do.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Oh, here is another really spooky type of propaganda against Russia - religious propaganda!

Some Christians, mainly in the USA, believe that Russia would invade and attempt to obliterate Israel. The reason is that there is a rather complicated Bible prophecy about Israel being invaded by an enemy that fulfills certain criteria that Russia nominally fulfills. This would be part of a series of events around the end of the world as predicted by the Bible.

The idea was particularly strong in the days of the Cold War - a type of propaganda aimed at religious people, I guess. Or is it perfectly legitimate Bible interpretention? Christians elsewhere don't believe it though.

Many American Christians believe that modern Russia still fills all the criteria to fulfill this role. Since Iran is not popular with the USA at the moment, Iran plays a bigger role in this prophecy nowadays. In Cold War days, the main idea was the the USSR was the culprit.

I think the latest version of this idea is that Russia, Kazakhstan, Syria and Iran are involved in this conspiracy. Another thing I picked up was that Russia would be a part of "the one world government of the Antichrist".

Lots of preachers are actually preaching this to their congregations. Personally I don't think there is any point in trying to interpret scripture in this way, and I have to wonder about motivations of those who do.

Didn't you know that Russia is already "invaded" Israel with religion
Russia is one of the few Orthodox countries which priests allowed to enter Church of the Holy Sepulchre on the Orthodox Easter day to receive the Holy Fire on the Orthodox Easter Day
Holy Fire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Originally Posted by Hanna

Oh, here is another really spooky type of propaganda against Russia - religious propaganda!

Some Christians, mainly in the USA, believe that Russia would invade and attempt to obliterate Israel. The reason is that there is a rather complicated Bible prophecy about Israel being invaded by an enemy that fulfills certain criteria that Russia nominally fulfills. This would be part of a series of events around the end of the world as predicted by the Bible.

Hanna, you are right about this and frankly, it terrifies me. The religious fanatics in America have gone so far off the deep-end and they are throwing our country into a tailspin with their insane politics. Our economy is in tatters because of the endless wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, but they want to INCREASE our military activities around the globe and cut education, health care, and welfare for the millions of Americans who have lost their jobs and homes during our economic crisis. We keep calling it a recession, but it's far more akin to a depression. My father was a survivor of the Great Depression and I remember many of the stories he told me in childhood. It is becoming very similar to that now. There are thousands of American families living in their cars. Yet, the religious "right" (as in right wing, not morally "right") are more interested in making birth control illegal, requiring pregnant women to undergo all sorts of bizarre procedures at the behest of the State - even to the extent that miscarriage is now considered "manslaughter" in some states and women can go to JAIL for falling down while pregnant. They believe that a woman who is raped "deserves it" and should be forced to keep the baby, even if the "woman" in question is 13 years old and was raped by her own father!

I don't know how these people can call themselves "christian" when they are against everything Jesus stood for. They love money, and they hate people. When the tea Party went berserk and elected the most freakish candidates they could find to public office, there was a mad spate of insane laws passed all around the country. People can now bring guns into bars, libraries and schools in some states - there is an unjustified fear that Obama wants to "take away everyone's guns" (even though he has not enacted any gun control legislation and has even relaxed some restrictions), they openly threaten the President, are obsessed with his birth certificate and trying to prove he is "Muslim," and they have demolished regulations on big businesses so that people can be fired at will and have no recourse to dispute it, big businesses can pollute the environment, contaminate our drinking water, cause earthquakes with their "frakking" (drilling for natural gas) and dump more oil into our nature preserves and oceans. It's gone so far beyond simply disturbing that I don't have words for it anymore.

It's crazy here. The right wing loves guns, "god" (read: money) and wars - hates women, people of color, gays and foreigners - basically anyone who is not white, male and "christian" is their target. We now live in a bizarre alternate universe where up is down, down is sideways, and sideways is a banana!

The Grand duke

Приключения молодого немецкого пилота на восточном фронте, которому довелось повоевать с теми самыми Ночными Ведьмами.





Ахтунг, по ссылке лейтенантские сиськи!
ru_klukva_ru: The Grand duke

Originally Posted by BappaBa

The Grand duke
Приключения молодого немецкого пилота на восточном фронте, которому довелось повоевать с теми самыми Ночными Ведьмами.

И где здесь клюква? Картинки качественные. Только название колхоза на фюзеляже какое-странное.

Originally Posted by Anixx

И где здесь клюква? Картинки качественные. Только название колхоза на фюзеляже какое-странное.

Не дочитал с помощью какого оружия она хотела окончить войну к Рождеству?

Canadian Bacon (1995)

For example, by the mid 80's, the cost of a small cooperative apartment in Moscow was a couple of thousands rubles. How that money could be earned in the state where an average family monthly income was about 200 - 300 rubles was a mystery.

Do you want to say that the price of realty in large cities in other countries is smaller? I heard stories about people repaying their realty credits for 20 and 30 years.

If you disobey the state (aka break the law), that apartment would be taken from you by the state (aka the confiscation of the belongings).

Confiscation was only possible as a penal measure for crimes against property such as theft, robbery, fraud, extortion etc.

you would be obliged to liquidate your private property only to compensate another party for the amount decided by the court and the rest of the value of the property is yours

In the United States one can easily get life sentence for crimes against property. Confiscation is evidently more humane.

And it some cases it was very difficult to estimate the damage.

Indeed. That's why the state made it impossible to become rich through taking others' property. In today's Russia one can steal billions, hide them, get imprisoned for some 5-6 years and then continue a billionaire's lifestyle.

For example, if you secretly made private business producing something (e.g. the food) and selling it privately beyond the norms allowed by the state, you made the proprietary damage to "the people" since the "extra food" that you produced belongs to "the people" and you stole that from "the people" and it's very difficult to estimate the price. Hence, the confiscation of everything (with the subsequent imprisonment).

In any western state if you secretly make business and do not pay taxes or, say, produce counterfeit goods, you will be imprisoned as well.

Originally Posted by Anixx

Do you want to say that the price of realty in large cities in other countries is smaller? I heard stories about people repaying their realty credits for 20 and 30 years.

The only difference is that the young families actually LIVE IN THE APARTMENTS for those 20-30 years, and the cooperative apartments took 10 or more years TO BUILD after the money was paid.

Originally Posted by Anixx

Confiscation was only possible as a penal measure for crimes against property such as theft, robbery, fraud, extortion etc.

I think I gave a good example - a person who produced more goods than the norm allows and sold it privately. That was penalized by the confiscation. For example: the peasants were supposed to work in the public fields using the means of production (the machinery, the seeds, etc.) provided by the collective household using the directions provided by the collective household. At the same time, those peasants were able to maintain the tiny pieces of land in their private use - they could use private means of cultivating the land and use the crop produced by that land to feed themselves and to sell the extra on the market. If they were found of cultivating more than the norm - they were penalized by confiscation.

Originally Posted by Anixx

In the United States one can easily get life sentence for crimes against property.

Would you be able to cite a precedence? Maybe I misunderstood what you said.

Originally Posted by Anixx

Indeed. That's why the state made it impossible to become rich through taking others' property.

Well, that's not entirely true. The nomenclature had it all by confiscating property from other people.

Originally Posted by Anixx

In today's Russia one can steal billions, hide them, get imprisoned for some 5-6 years and then continue a billionaire's lifestyle.

That's very sad. Like I said, if the personal belongings had been registered under the name of the thief's relative, they weren't confiscated as well by the Soviet State leading to the similar situation on the smaller scale.

Originally Posted by Anixx

In any western state if you secretly make business and do not pay taxes or, say, produce counterfeit goods, you will be imprisoned as well.

I think that addresses a different concern. The Soviet Laws prohibited even the small enterprises. Had any of the enterprises been legally allowed, some of them would pay taxes and some of them would evade it.

Originally Posted by Crocodile

I think I gave a good example - a person who produced more goods than the norm allows and sold it privately.

From the material of the employer? Which article of the penal code do you mean?

Originally Posted by Crocodile

That was penalized by the confiscation.

Only the court decided whether to apply confiscation in each case. Confiscation was not mandatory and was applied only to grave and exceptionally grave crimes. Commiting a venal crime was not an automatic reason for confiscation. Confisctaion could be not only of the whole property but also of 1/2, 1/3 or any other part of the property of the offender.

Originally Posted by Crocodile

For example: the peasants were supposed to work in the public fields using the means of production (the machinery, the seeds, etc.) provided by the collective household using the directions provided by the collective household. At the same time, those peasants were able to maintain the tiny pieces of land in their private use - they could use private means of cultivating the land and use the crop produced by that land to feed themselves and to sell the extra on the market. If they were found of cultivating more than the norm - they were penalized by confiscation.

Confiscation of the excess or of the whole property? This is bullshit. Producing something in excess of a norm is not a crime against property like theft. It could not be qualified as a grave crime unless the volume of the damage was enormous. Do you have any reference to such a case? What year it was, what was the volume of damage and what part of property was confiscated?

I also did not find any reference about that such norm that limited production ever existed.

Well, that's not entirely true. The nomenclature had it all by confiscating property from other people.

Any confiscated property went to the state, not to nomenclature. In the USSR even among nomenclature were no rich people even comparable to today's medium-successful businessman.

That's very sad. Like I said, if the personal belongings had been registered under the name of the thief's relative, they weren't confiscated as well by the Soviet State leading to the similar situation on the smaller scale.

Possibly, and what? This just means the investigation did not succeed to trace where the property gone.

I think that addresses a different concern. The Soviet Laws prohibited even the small enterprises. Had any of the enterprises been legally allowed, some of them would pay taxes and some of them would evade it.

Soviet laws were favorable to enterprises where all the participants worked themselves and collectively owned the means of production. Such enterprises were never prohibited.