Thread: Edward Snowden and his stay in Russia

Originally Posted by Hanna

Well -- Americans may have a lot of media to choose from, but 95% and the most accessible media is giving the "mainstream", gov't supported line.
The majority of people will eventually fall for it.

Actually, public opinion in the US has swung in favor of Edward Snowden. There were a lot of people calling him a traitor in the beginning, but as more information came out and it became clear just how vast the scope of government surveillance truly is, more people started calling him a hero. And these days, the majority of Americans already KNOW that the mainstream media is bullshit. There has been a rise of alternative news sources and citizen journalism, which on the one hand I applaud, but at the same time it also gives rise to a lot of conspiracy theories and fake news stories which garner more attention than they should.

Most of the people I know are like me - they gather their news from a variety of sources both foreign and domestic. In that way, we can deduce what is true and what is not true.

Poll: Americans say Snowden isn’t a traitor — MSNBC

Approximately 55% of American voters view Snowden as a “whistle-blower,” according to new Quinnipiac University poll. Only 34% consider him a “traitor” for revealing details on two of the nation’s top secret surveillance programs.

A majority view him as a whistle-blower in every subgroup–political party, gender, income, education, and age–except for African -American voters, among whom 43% call him a traitor and 42% a whistle-blower.

Researchers also spotted a “massive swing in public opinion” when it comes to how the public feels about spying programs in relation to civil liberties. Now, 45% of voters say the government goes way too far restricting civil liberties in regard to its anti-terrorism efforts. That’s a big switch from 2010 when 63% felt the government didn’t go far enough in its efforts to protect the country from terrorists.

It is clear that Snowden's revelations have also succeeded in getting people TALKING more about the police state we live in here. It isn't just the extremists talking about it either, now it has become a mainstream discussion. Everyone I know is talking about it, and everyone I know agrees that the NSA has gone too far.

Originally Posted by Deborski

Actually, public opinion in the US has swung in favor of Edward Snowden. There were a lot of people calling him a traitor in the beginning, but as more information came out and it became clear just how vast the scope of government surveillance truly is, more people started calling him a hero. And these days, the majority of Americans already KNOW that the mainstream media is bullshit. There has been a rise of alternative news sources and citizen journalism, which on the one hand I applaud, but at the same time it also gives rise to a lot of conspiracy theories and fake news stories which garner more attention than they should.

Most of the people I know are like me - they gather their news from a variety of sources both foreign and domestic. In that way, we can deduce what is true and what is not true.

Poll: Americans say Snowden isn’t a traitor — MSNBC



It is clear that Snowden's revelations have also succeeded in getting people TALKING more about the police state we live in here. It isn't just the extremists talking about it either, now it has become a mainstream discussion. Everyone I know is talking about it, and everyone I know agrees that the NSA has gone too far.

Deb, you've been so much talking about the "black-and-white thinking" lately, and here you just demonstrate another example of it. I for one have never thought of that guy as a traitor or a hero, I think those are too strong words for a guy like him. He just did something not very smart and got busted.

Originally Posted by Eric C.

Deb, you've been so much talking about the "black-and-white thinking" lately, and here you just demonstrate another example of it. I for one have never thought of that guy as a traitor or a hero, I think those are too strong words for a guy like him. He just did something not very smart and got busted.

:shrug: I was quoting a poll taken of US citizens, so I am not sure how I personally engaged in "black or white thinking" here. My own opinion is that he's more hero than traitor. He broke the law, certainly, but sometimes there are higher laws which we have to abide by, which supersede petty legalities. A crucial factor is that Snowden did not sell the information for money. In my mind, that separates him from those who steal US secrets for the sake of making a personal profit.

Snowden wins whistleblower award in Germany — RT News

From this article:

The organizers of the prize commended Snowden’s work, stating that he had uncovered “massive and unsuspecting monitoring and storage of communication data, which cannot be accepted in democratic societies.”

The audience also heard a statement by Edward Snowden from Russia read out at the ceremony. “We should never forget the lessons of history when surveillance took the upper hand,” he said.

“Not only did [German Chancellor Angela Merkel], it seems, allow the US to spy on Germany, but it seems she also helped the US to spy on Germany. So this is one of the reasons why Edward Snowden has received this award,” RT correspondent Peter Oliver said from the ceremony in Berlin. “He is being honored with this by a number of groups for his work in revealing what turns out to be the wide ranging spying activities of the NSA and the US.”

The whistleblower award was first awarded in 1999 under the auspices of the Association of German Scientists and the German chapter of the International Association of Lawyers Against Nuclear Arms (IALANA).

Snowden’s father has not yet been issued Russian visa – report — RT News

Apparently Edward Snowden's father is having difficulty coming to Moscow to visit him. Is this just typical bureaucratic red tape encountered during the visa process? Or is something else going on?

The father of NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden still cannot enter Moscow to visit his son because the Russian consulate needs the Foreign Ministry to sanction his visa before it can be issued, Russian media reported.

"The fact is that Lon Snowden still does not have a valid Russia visa,” a source close to Snowden Sr. said, as quoted by ITAR-TASS news agency. “When Lon’s lawyers asked for an explanation at one of the Russian consular offices, the response was that Russian Foreign Ministry needs to issue a sanction, which was not done yet, and only then a visa can be issued.”

Lon Snowden and his lawyer Bruce Fein appeared on ABC News on August 11, stating that they had received Russian visas and believed their trip would happen in the near future. Both Snowden and Fein thought the visa issue had already been resolved.

The source could not name the reasons for the delay, but did note that Snowden Sr. is still planning a trip to Moscow and is looking forward to seeing his son.

In other news, sounds like Edward has learned a few Russian words.

In the meantime, Snowden is spending his time traveling across Russia. He is learning about local customs and traditions through books that were passed on to him, Moskovskiy Komsomolets newspaper cited Snowden’s lawyer Anatoly Kucherena as saying.

The whistleblower is now able to speak a little bit of Russian. “Some words he can pronounce very clearly,” Kucherena said.

Originally Posted by Deborski

Is this just typical bureaucratic red tape encountered during the visa process? Or is something else going on?

У меня две версии:
1) Американскую визу получить тоже не просто и не быстро. Так что, наша бюрократия мстит.
2) ФСБ нужно время на разработку операции "встреча отца и сына". Надо сделать так, чтобы американские шпионы не пронюхали, где младший Сноуден живёт. А Старший Сноуден может привести за собой "хвост".

In other news, sounds like Edward has learned a few Russian words.

Эти слова цензурные, надеюсь...

Originally Posted by Юрка

У меня две версии:
1) Американскую визу получить тоже не просто и не быстро. Так что, наша бюрократия мстит.
2) ФСБ нужно время на разработку операции "встреча отца и сына". Надо сделать так, чтобы американские шпионы не пронюхали, где младший Сноуден живёт. А Старший Сноуден может привести за собой "хвост".

Вот, интересный взгляд... наверное, правильно. Спасибо.

Originally Posted by Deborski

Вот, интересный вид... Наверное правильно. Спасибо.

интересный взгляд
наверное,

Originally Posted by Deborski

Вот, интересный взгляд... наверное, правильно. Спасибо.

Дебора, у меня родилась ещё одна версия: Сирия.
Возможно, что наши дипломаты решили не поднимать и не бередить скандальную тему Сноудена, пока есть шанс решить сирийскую проблему. В обоих случаях речь идёт о гуманитарных проблемах, но ставки в Сирии больше. Но как только Сирию начнут бомбить, наши дадут визу.

Originally Posted by Юрка

Дебора, у меня родилась ещё одна версия: Сирия.
Возможно, что наши дипломаты решили не поднимать и не бередить скандальную тему Сноудена, пока есть шанс решить сирийскую проблему. В обоих случаях речь идёт о гуманитарных проблемах, но ставки в Сирии больше. Но как только Сирию начнут бомбить, наши дадут визу.

Я согласна, что ставки в Сирии больше.
Интересная теория.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/29/us...s.html?hp&_r=0

N.S.A. Examines Social Networks of U.S. Citizens

Отец Сноудена прилетел сегодня в Москву. Адвокат Кучерена заметил слежку. Ссылка.

Originally Posted by Юрка

Адвокат Кучерена заметил слежку

ЦРУ такие очаровашки

Check out the fantastic interview with Assange on RT today, covering the subject of Snowden in depth.

Turns out that Sarah Harrison a British journalist is also hiding in Russia for her involvement with the Snowden leaks. She literally can't return to the UK without facing arrest.
For telling the freaking truth in the so-called free media!
That's where we got to.

Assange thinks she'll have to stay indefinitely in Russia too.

Father of Edward Snowden says the NSA leaker is 'totally happy' and 'feels that his life is out of danger' in Russia | Mail Online

NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden is enjoying his new life in Russia and believes he is out of danger, his father Lon claimed on today.

'He feels safe here and totally happy,' said Snowden senior as he left Moscow after an 'emotional' reunion with his controversial 'whistleblower' son.

'He is grateful to Russia, and admits that he imagined it to be a very different country.'

Yeah, good. But you spot the angle, don't you? Papers like the Daily Mail are completely incapable of writing anything that would portray Russia as a nice country, decent living conditions and normal people. It's either exaggerated stereotypes about communism, complaints about the current Russian leadership, or poverty, criminality etc. Lately, human rights and gay issues.

Note how the article picked up on the fact that both Snowden and his dad where totally surprised about the warm reception in Russia and the nice lifestyle to be had. It's really discouraging -- particularly in light of Russia dropping the ideology that Daily Mail hates, and going all out in the other direction. The Mail still feels compelled to blackpaint Russia.

With such devoted defenders, nothing seems to be able to succeed in blackpainting that country

Meanwhile
ФСБ добивается полного доступа к данным интернет-пользователей - ПОЛИТ.РУ

Originally Posted by dtrq

Meanwhile
ФСБ добивается полного доступа к данным интернет-пользователей - ПОЛИТ.РУ

Just because someone disputes the 'cheerleader' factor above, it doesn't mean one supports whatever that paper writes.

So, I will suggest that the other two posters above fail to consider that Mr. Snowden is going to be positive no matter what. Of course, he'll praise the only country that took him. Duhhhhh..... Also, anything is better there than being behind bars in, for e.g., the USA.

With all that said, all praise Putin.... WHAT A WONDERFUL GUY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good article above and it shows he is Russia's hero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here's A Very Interesting Picture Of Edward Snowden On A Boat In Russia - Yahoo Finance