Thread: dialects

You mean they are used to show stress? I never knew! Thanks, monichka.

As for Russian, the stress marks are not shown because it is assumed a Russian speaker instinctively knows where to put the stress. In words where the meaning is ambiguous without stress, there is usually a stress mark printed.

Originally Posted by Pravit

As for Russian, the stress marks are not shown because it is assumed a Russian speaker instinctively knows where to put the stress.

Yeah, just like English and, I guess, most other languages.

In words where the meaning is ambiguous without stress, there is usually a stress mark printed.

I've never seen that. Could you give an example?

Originally Posted by waxwing

I've never seen that. Could you give an example?

The words мука (flour) - мука (suffering) are usually printed with stress mark.

Hmmm .. I would have thought you could usually guess it from context

how about : мука - очень тяжёлая

Originally Posted by waxwing

how about : мука - очень тяжёлая

My working class origin says to me about "flour". I imagine a 50 kg flour bag. Actually it depends on context, you are right. I never expect to see "sufferring" in a cooking recipe's book. But they usually print a stress mark in belletristic literature books.

Belletristic literature! I must admit, this is one of the few times Russians have actually taught me new English words.

Originally Posted by Pravit

You mean they are used to show stress? I never knew! Thanks, monichka.

You are welcome!

As for Russian, the stress marks are not shown because it is assumed a Russian speaker instinctively knows where to put the stress. In words where the meaning is ambiguous without stress, there is usually a stress mark printed.

Ay, ay ay! that is one reason why Russian is so difficult to learn for Spanish speaking people! Thanks Pravit!

That is one reason why Russian is difficult to learn for all people, not just Spanish speakers

Originally Posted by Pravit

Belletristic literature! I must admit, this is one of the few times Russians have actually taught me new English words.

There is a wide used expression in Russian "художественная литература" or more formal "беллетристика". It includes novels, poems, stories, tales, sci-fiction... in another words all books for fun.

I know the term художественная литература but I have never heard the term "belletristic literature" used in English, since "literature" is usually assumed to mean (художественная) литература unless the context would mean it is technical literature or something like that. However, using Lingvo to look up the meaning of "belletristic", I got "художественная литература", so you could say I learned the meaning of the English word from Russian

Originally Posted by JJ

Originally Posted by Pravit

Belletristic literature! I must admit, this is one of the few times Russians have actually taught me new English words.

There is a wide used expression in Russian "художественная литература" or more formal "беллетристика". It includes novels, poems, stories, tales, sci-fiction... in another words all books for fun.

It sounds like 'fiction' to me ... ? And indeed lingvo.yandex.ru gives беллетристика as one of the translations of 'fiction'.

You said that russians don't use stress marks because they can just figure out where the stress is, but i think that is not true. In fact, when i was in russia this summer, some people told me that people from different social classes put the stress on different syllabes, and it is quite easy to spot people who did not receive a formal education just by listening to them and seeing where do they stress certain words.

Did anyone else hear about that?

by the way, i thinkl that the spanish way of writing words is the best one ever invented...you now how to read any single word, where the accent is...the word contains all the information you need to pronounce it....not like in english or russian...

Originally Posted by Anonymous

by the way, i thinkl that the spanish way of writing words is the best one ever invented...you now how to read any single word, where the accent is...the word contains all the information you need to pronounce it....not like in english or russian...

Not all words have accent marks in Spanish. Also, one syllable words sometimes have accent marks.

Originally Posted by Anonymous

You said that russians don't use stress marks because they can just figure out where the stress is, but i think that is not true. In fact, when i was in russia this summer, some people told me that people from different social classes put the stress on different syllabes, and it is quite easy to spot people who did not receive a formal education just by listening to them and seeing where do they stress certain words.

Did anyone else hear about that?

This is true for some common words like ложить and some others I can't remember now. But for most words, Russians can guess the stress correctly. Just like English speakers. Upon being presented a word they've never seen before, most English speakers, regardless of education level, can pronounce the word correctly and with the right stress.

Originally Posted by Линдзи

Not all words have accent marks in Spanish. Also, one syllable words sometimes have accent marks.

I'm spanish...i know that, believe me

Originally Posted by Линдзи

Originally Posted by Anonymous

by the way, i thinkl that the spanish way of writing words is the best one ever invented...you now how to read any single word, where the accent is...the word contains all the information you need to pronounce it....not like in english or russian...

Not all words have accent marks in Spanish. Also, one syllable words sometimes have accent marks.

Accentuation rules in Spanish are very easy and just a few, if you learn them you may understand and diferentiate the meaning of words very easily. The thing is that when you write you must not to forget to write the accents. This is one problem the Russian and English speakers don

Is preterito plusquamperfecto similar to something like "I had done something"? In other words, an action that happened in a past before the past that we're talking about?

Originally Posted by Pravit

Is preterito plusquamperfecto similar to something like "I had done something"? In other words, an action that happened in a past before the past that we're talking about?

Yes! It is the past before just another past...it is easier to say the action than to describe it!

Originally Posted by Pravit

... This is true for some common words like ложить and some others I can't remember now. But for most words, Russians can guess the stress correctly. Just like English speakers. Upon being presented a word they've never seen before, most English speakers, regardless of education level, can pronounce the word correctly and with the right stress.

Well I can remember that Gorby used to say ( and probably still does ) нАчать прИнять и углУбить ( instead of начАть, принЯть and углубИть )

Originally Posted by Anonymous

Originally Posted by Pravit

Is preterito plusquamperfecto similar to something like "I had done something"? In other words, an action that happened in a past before the past that we're talking about?

Yes! It is the past before just another past...it is easier to say the action than to describe it!

In English this is the "past perfect". We also used to use the term pluperfect, but it seems to have fallen out of usage.