Thread: Travel Blog; CIS/ex-USSR countries (i.e. Russian speaking)

Originally Posted by Dmitry Khomitchuk

Decision of building new society in the single state (note: state, communism declines states) was kept. The idea was to build socialistic society that in future will spread all over the world and make coming of communism easy. Government doctrine was never called communism. Marksism, Marksism-Lenininsm, Socialism. Bad translation and black propaganda.

Первый Секретарь ЦК КПСС Н. С. Хрущёв объявил в октябре 1961 года на XXII съезде КПСС, что к 1980 году в СССР будет создана материальная база коммунизма — «Нынешнее поколение советских людей будет жить при коммунизме!».

Коммунизм — Википедия

Мы в коммунизме будем жить (Здравствуй, будущее!)
Музыка: В. Мурадели Слова: Е. Долматовский

Здравствуй, Будущее, здравствуй!
Прорвались мы в пределы твои!
Всей страною под знаменем красным
Сквозь лишенья, преграды, бои.

Припев:

Мы будем жить при коммунизме!
Его рубеж не так далёк.
Трудом мы, подвигом приблизим
Великий день, заветный срок.


Здравствуй, Будущее, здравствуй!
Сквозь огонь мы тебя пронесли.
Ты придешь к нам не сказочным царством,
А расцветом советской земли!

Припев.

Здравствуй, Будущее, здравствуй!
…… ленинской сделаешь ты
Все мечты о свободе и счастье,
Всех времён и народов мечты.

Припев.
http://sovmusic.ru/download.php?fname=comunism

Yes, but Basil77 - Khrushchev was a politician and an idealist... Just because he said it, doesn't mean it happened!

And I don't think Marx said that families were wrong... (Can't remember even hearing about it, other than here - but I am no expert on communism - where does this information come from..?) Maybe it was some later communist who said that? And as far as I know, all that Marx said about religion was that it is used to manipulate people, and that it's untrue. But he didn't say to ban it, did he? (Personally I find the idea of banning religion VERY unpleasant and some of the things that the USSR did against the church are disgusting!)

But to be honest, my knowledge about communism is a bit fluffy, I read about it a very long time ago and have probably forgotten lots of important points, and I am not interested enough to re-read anything. And regarding the USSR: I only saw the "nice" sides, since I visited as a tourist, and was a kid on holiday... And saw it on TV. It's clear that people like Crocodile and others had some truly awful and crappy experiences in the USSR, I want to respect that.

I'm sorry for offtopic, but somewhere in this thread I saw that salary in belarus is about $1500 (if i remember right). So, today i've read the news and found this: TUT.BY | НОВОСТИ - В Речице состоялась предупредительная забастовка пивоваров - Общество - 24.05.2011, 09:11. .. Numbers in this news is a little bit far from $1500

Originally Posted by Dmitry Khomitchuk

About Belarussian names - it is government policy to save Belarussian language, because very few amount of people uses it.

) Actually it seems to me that the government policy do everything to destroy Belarussian language as well as every little bit of Belorussian self-consciousness. Just IMHO

Originally Posted by Hanna

Thanks for explaining about the mobile phone numbers. I could never have guessed that!

But how to find a teacher...? Maybe there is some forum or something... I'll check if there is an expat forum.
And does anyone know precisely how to get to МИНСКОЕ МОРЕ with public transport?
I think there is a train or something, but where can I by tickets, how long does it take to get there etc?

If I've not mistaken I had already posted that I can ask my friend (a teacher from State Linguistic University) to connect with you. I don't know if she would like to teach you but she probably can recommend someone. If you are still interested - you are welcome.
You can by tickets from central railway station (metro Площадь Ленина ) to the station "Минское Море" if you want civil plages or to "Ратомка" or "Зеленое" and go by suburban train in the Молодечно direction. Usually they go from lines #22-23 (I'm not sure in numbers though) to the right from the station building (As for me the best way to reach Минское море is to rent a bicycle, it's about 5 km from Minsk). By the way "Площадь Ленина " it's an old sovietic name, after USSR had collapsed there was a high tide of self consiousness of belarusian society and during this time many old sovietic names were renamed. So it happend to "Lenina place" it became an "Independence place" but all the interior decoration in the metro was connected with Lenin image so it was the reason I think, why the government decided to leave the old name of the station and now there is a such confusion for foreigners )

Originally Posted by Hanna

It's clear that people like Crocodile and others had some truly awful and crappy experiences in the USSR, I want to respect that

У Крокодила был ужасный опыт в СССР? Можно по-подробнее, это какой такой опыт? Его заставили стоять в очереди за бананами или что-то ещё более ужасное?

Originally Posted by Юрка

У Крокодила был ужасный опыт в СССР?

Well the venerable Crocodile hasn't gone into any specific details but he disliked it enough to leave the country, and he hasn't said anything good about it here, ever, as far as I can recall. I am pretty sure it was not to his taste!

Thanks for explaining Whiteknight! I actually went there yesterday, but it took about 2 hours on the train station before I figured out how to get there.... (the easiest way was with a Marschrutka, but I took the train back!)

Had a lovely time (will post some pictures) for a few hours, but after that there was an absolutely horrendous thunder storm. I got completely soaked.... Thunderstorms seem really common in Belarus! There have been 3 since I arrived, and they are massive! Thunder, flashing and the skies open up!

Would you still want to meet up, and have time? Perhaps we can go for a walk, a coffee or something to drink? I'll send you a text, I think your mobile number is somewhere in this thread.

And on the Belarus salaries: Frankly there must be quite a big variation. Some people in Minsk are clearly on much more than the 1500 figure mentioned here.... and maybe there really are people living on a few hundred "y.e." a month. Respect to them, must be really hard and frustrating. I think it depends greatly on how much they pay in rent per month.

Originally Posted by WhiteKnight

Hi, I've just returned from Crimea to Minsk, so yesterday I celebrated The Victory day in a train . If you like, we can meet the other day I'll be glad to communicate with you! I can even order some sightseeing around Minsk if you like.

What's concern russian language courses - almost every foreign languages center has a russian departament for foreigners
Курсы русского языка для иностранцев.
Курсы иностранных языков
Русский для иностранцев | Курсы и обучение в Беларуси - Лидер образовательный центр
Факультеты и кафедры - Факультет русского языка для иностранных граждан
Общий курс русского языка \\ Streamline - курсы иностранных языков.

Yup, here is your excellent post! And while looking for it, I also found the one that you made about the shops that "might" sell soy milk . Now that I have "found my feet" here in Minsk I'll get there and check it out. I can't make up my mind about whether to take lessons or not. Still thinking about it.

Your explanation about the Lenin Square metro station makes sense too... The only thing about these different names, like you said, is that it confuses visitors. For example, I did not know the word that that means "Independence" - and it's a different word in Russian v. Belarussian so I was not able to guess. And you are surely right about the Soviet decoration on that metro station! The other confusing place is the street that people call "Skariny" which is in fact marked everywhere on maps and street signs as "Independence" - somebody I met on the train to Minsk warned me about that though.

Originally Posted by WhiteKnight

I remember a sign "Soy milk" on the Brovki str. Between University of Informatics an Radioelectronics buildings. if I have not mistaken right after the second block wich address is 6-Brovki str., But it was quite long time ago. I've never seen this stuff in shops. The only thing i can think of is here also I know a health meal shop in the Metro Pushkinskaya. May be there you'll find some kind of the stuff, I'm really not sure

Originally Posted by WhiteKnight

) Actually it seems to me that the government policy do everything to destroy Belarussian language as well as every little bit of Belorussian self-consciousness. Just IMHO

Interesting viewpoint. So Lukashenko's funny comment that a Belarussian is a Russian with a quality mark did not convince you, or the "Мы Беларусь!" campaign on town? Maybe it's more rhetoric and no real action. And I sympathise with the point that you made about Belarus being "landlocked". Yes, there is something a bit sad about a country that has no coast.

Belarus politics is too complicated for me to understand. I always take a positive viewpoint and try to look for the good points in things and there are many good things here to point at. But I can understand peoples extreme frustration at things like currency devaluation or the status of a language they love (i.e. Belarussian in your case).

It-ogo was writing a while back how he wanted to speak more Ukraininan but somehow it just feels complicated and he sticks with Russian because it's more convenient.

)) Yeah our climate is under influence from Baltic but it has continental character, that differs from marine scandinavian and UK. So in may there are usually heavy rains with thunders. There is a poem by Fyodor Tutchev about this phenomenon

Люблю грозу в начале мая,
Когда весенний, первый гром,
Как бы резвяся и играя,
Грохочет в небе голубом.

Гремят раскаты молодые!
Вот дождик брызнул, пыль летит...
Повисли перлы дождевые,
И солнце нити золотит...

С горы бежит поток проворный,
В лесу не молкнет птичий гам,
И гам лесной, и шум нагорный —
Все вторит весело громам...

Ты скажешь: ветреная Геба,
Кормя Зевесова орла,
Громокипящий кубок с неба,
Смеясь, на землю пролила!

Yeah I'd really like to meet with you! There is quite a problem to get a chance to talk with English spoken person here. So I would be very appreciated! If you have Skype you can find me there my nick is iwhiteknight

Originally Posted by Hanna

It-ogo was writing a while back how he wanted to speak more Ukraininan but somehow it just feels complicated and he sticks with Russian because it's more convenient.

It's obvious for every Belarus, I think, that without the real governmental support of the belarussian language, culture and traditions they are going to extinct very soon. The only enthusiasm of a few people is not enough. But our government do nothing to support it and as I can see by many examples such as deny of performances, of some musical bands, theaters and so on they aim to eliminate self-conscious people from the society. It's very sad . It reminds me a social pressure in Bask Country during the WWII, but their national idea was tried to be eliminated by enemies...

Originally Posted by Hanna

I am pretty sure it was not to his taste!

Это наверняка. Кстати, сам Крокодил мне тоже не по вкусу. Спорит по каждому поводу, зануда. Он наверное, был у нас преподавателем в ВУЗе.

Originally Posted by Юрка

Кстати, сам Крокодил мне тоже не по вкусу.

=) Вы просто не умеете их готовить (с)

I think the language situation in Belarus is similar to that of Norwey, where there are two official languages: bokmol and nynorsk. One is spoken by majority of the population, while other is created of various dialects of western coast.

Norway has a completely incredible amount of very distinct dialects... It's because it used to be quite difficult to travel around the country, and people were just staying in their own village (until recently). So each place spoke in their own way and it didn't matter very much if it became incomprehensible to everyone else. Norway has belonged to both Sweden and Denmark at different times. Bokmål is not really a dialect (it means "book speech"), it's just a way of writing, which looks quite a lot like Danish.
However, when Norwegians speak, it's much more similar to Swedish than to Danish.
Nynorsk is a way of writing Norwegian which is more similar to how people actually speak (at least in some parts of the country). But the majority don't like this way of writing anyway, only some people do, and there is a lot of debate about it. Norwegians are supposed to learn both ways of writing and it complicates things a bit for them, and wastes time.
The problem is that their written language (Bokmål) is designed to look like Danish, and it does not correspond to how people actually speak. I think that instead of having 2 written languages, they should have a reform and combine the two.
Or, they could just use Swedish Norwegian is essentially Swedish with a funny accent, a few words that are different, and different spelling.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Yes, but Basil77 - Khrushchev was a politician and an idealist... Just because he said it, doesn't mean it happened!

I never said it did, I was replying to Dmitry's post.

And I don't think Marx said that families were wrong... (Can't remember even hearing about it, other than here - but I am no expert on communism - where does this information come from..?) Maybe it was some later communist who said that?

It was Friedrich Engels' idea, he was a gay after all so it's no wonder he suggested this crap. But it doesn't matter, I'm shutting up about -isms for now. Sorry for creating another off-topic here. I'd better wait for you to post another pictures of beautiful Belorussia.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Norwegian is essentially Swedish with a funny accent, a few words that are different, and different spelling.

Or maybe vice-versa

Photos of an absolutely amazing market called "Kamarovskiy".
Why is this market so cool? It is extremely large, completely clean, very well organised, no crooks or dishonest vendors...
I have never seen something like this in my life.












Outside the market, a bronze horse sculpture and a fountain.
Sorry about the bad quality, I am a terrible photographer and I have not yet read the manual for my camera




A park named for Simon Bolivar of Venezuela

A woman is reading in the park



Nationalistic campaign that can be seen across Belarus


In a suburb of Minsk
Wow, it looks and feels exactly like my childhood! The layout is so similar, and the nature.
But such suburbs are not the same in Sweden anymore.






My outing to Minskoe More ("Minsk Sea")

Train station after terrible thunderstorm


If you come from a Northern country, there is nothing more relaxing than the sight of pine trees and Birch trees (in England, they hardly exist). The nature of Belarus seems identical to Sweden's, even though Belarus is much further South. Not sure why.

I have noticed that Belarussian shops sell juice made from Birch sap. It tastes sweet and very good.

Approaching the sea



The beach (there is much more... ) Basically they have created an artificial beach (by dumping lots of sand on the shore of the lake) for about 2 kilometres. There are some benches and tables etc for people to use while enjoying the beach. My grandfather and his neighbours created a small beach in the same way, at his summer cottage (dacha).



By the canal-side in Central Minsk



The Swedish Embassy (note that the building is pre-war, unusual in Minsk!)



Palace of the Republic



MUST-VISIT (for Women) IMPULSE shopping centre [Импульс]
Near the Kamarovskiy Market is an absolutely amazing shopping centre aimed at younger women. I have never seen such a thing; Definitely not up-market but clean and well organised. It consists of little booths absolutely crammed with makeup products, clothes or jewellery. To get anything, you have to speak with the saleswoman, who gets it from the back of the shop. An amazing range of products is available - I was looking for something and found it, which frankly I had not expected. This is not a place to shop for high-end expensive looking fashion, but it's a great place for bargains and simply an experience to visit. Recommended!!!

I am going to read the manual for this camera now.
The quality of my pictures is terrible.

I hope you got something from the pictures anyway.
Minsk is a very pleasant and impressive city in many different ways.

--------------------------------

EDIT: Apparently you are supposed to first focus on the object by pressing the button halfway down.. Then when it's focussed, you should actually take the picture.
Hm....

COMING SOON:
Pictures of places I am about to visit:
-Botanical Gardens
-Minsk, the City of Heroes - War memorial
-Troitskoe Suburb - an area restored to look like several hundred years ago.
-and Dudutki Village (a traditional Handicraft village - if I can figure out how to get there...)

I also want to find out where the Russian embassy is, and submit a visa application, since I have finally got my Minsk registration sorted out, thanks to Yuri's (landlord) dodgy contacts...(according to the registration, I am staying at a hotel called "Turist".)

There is a really horrible memorial which I don't want to go to alone, just too sad. It is called Khatyn, and it's about war crimes by the Nazis in Belarus. Among other things, inhabitants of several villages were locked inside of buildings and burnt alive.

Almost 3 million Belarussians died in the war - that's 1 of 4 people in the country at that time. All of Minsk was destroyed. It IS surely a small miracle to rebuild and recover so quickly.