Thread: Russia: old system - new system

Originally Posted by Nerms

If one drives 50km in the wrong direction (capitalism), it makes no sense to continue to drive in the wrong direction. You turn the car around and drive back to where you made your mistake. Continuing to drive in the wrong direction only makes it harder to fix the situation.

If its an issue of disruption...then say every 5 years change over 25% of your economy to a non-capitalist system. Throwing out all elements of capitalism of those 25% ecomonic elements. You should be back where you started in 20 years. Back to the workers paradise over what you have now which is a capitalist hell hole. If 25% is to much make it 10%. Things should get better as you go as well. I dont understand why if everyone wants to do this it doesnt happen?

IMHO, because there was no "workers paradise". I think warm memories from childhood have nothing to do with the real economic situation. People had to work hard for laughable money, but what was the worst was that there was no force to protect their interests, the trade unions were completely pro-governmental, and the second thing, sometimes even having plenty of money, one couldn't get what they wanted through official stores, they had to search for other ways around, sometimes illegal, and take the risk of being tricked or even detained by the soviet police...

Originally Posted by Eric C.

People had to work hard for laughable money, ....

Actually the problem was that you did NOT have to work hard at all. You could be the worst worker ever, and you'd still get the same payment as everyone else, because such was the law. There was almost zero chance to get fired too.
It demotivated those who could work better (why bother if you still get your money despite your poor performance?), and it was one of the reasons Soviet economy was in trouble. Too many slackers.

Originally Posted by Eric C.

"socialist paradise", "workers paradise". ...

Guys, Eric in particular; where are you getting this silly terminology from? Nobody here has claimed that modern Belarus or the USSR were a "paradise". (Quotes are supposed to indicate something that somebody has actually said.) No leader of any socialist country made such claims. They knew that they had a very long way to go. I agree with Gromozeka - if this is supposed to be irony, then you are hitting the wrong note. If you are really interested in such things, then read some Marx or Weber and get the terminology right! Otherwise I suggest you pass completely.

The idea of simply rolling back time and bringing the USSR, or even socialism back, is not realistic.
The most important thing is that people in Russia and the CIS countries get governments that are not corrupt and work to improve things for the population as a whole. The ideology is irrelevant, it's the results that count and there is no easy answer or solution. Anyway, the problem is common across the world.

Unfortunately in the world at large, things are moving in the exact opposite direction. Capitalism (large corporations, banks, media empire, defense industry) is getting increasingly greedy, corrupt and aggressive across the world and regular people are just pawns, at best. Traditional socialism never adapted itself to counteract modern capitalism. Socialism was "beaten" because it's opponent, capitalism, was more adaptive and more ruthless.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Guys, Eric in particular; where are you getting this silly terminology from? Nobody here has claimed that modern Belarus or the USSR were a "paradise". (Quotes are supposed to indicate something that somebody has actually said.) No leader of any socialist country made such claims. They knew that they had a very long way to go. I agree with Gromozeka - if this is supposed to be irony, then you are hitting the wrong note. If you are really interested in such things, then read some Marx or Weber and get the terminology right! Otherwise I suggest you pass completely.

I've been borrowing such terminology from those I was talking to. It was not me who first came up with the terms. =))