Thread: Americans shocked: Soviet troops approach the countrys heart

It'd be better for Russia to just leave all the former soviet republics to the mercy of fate.

Why to struggle for dominance? Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. Very soon.

Put an embargo, recall the ambassadors, break all the relationships. They won't survive by themselves. They have nothing to produce, they have nothing to sell.

You wished independence? You get it.

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. They won't survive by themselves.

It's not like they were doing so well surviving under Stalin's reign of terror Have you forgotten about the gulag?

Have you forgotten about the gulag?

What's the point then? You're free to go! You're independent

No trade relations with Russia, no cheap gas and oil. We are cruel invaders after all. No business with us. At all.

Huh?

Originally Posted by Dogboy182

Originally Posted by Siriusly

Is it really good farmland; and, if so, why is it an impoverished nation? And, why do the Russian want it so much?

Because it foolishly broke from the soviet union and now has nothing going for it.

It would be quite funny to see it not breaking from the Soviet Union They would have been the only ones left. Thinking about it, it does sound like a great idea! They'd occupy the UN seat of the Soviet Union, etc etc -- nice! where were you in 1991?

Seriously though, they are an impoverished nation because of the civil wars that were going on for a while, and some of which are still unresolved. Things do seem to be improving now.

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

It'd be better for Russia to just leave all the former soviet republics to the mercy of fate.

Why to struggle for dominance? Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. Very soon.

Put an embargo, recall the ambassadors, break all the relationships. They won't survive by themselves. They have nothing to produce, they have nothing to sell.

You wished independence? You get it.

hehe, /me remembers the exact same talk about the Baltic countries back in Soviet times
In 20 years we might be hearing the same thing about Siberia

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. They won't survive by themselves.

It's not like they were doing so well surviving under Stalin's reign of terror

Where was Stalin from again?

Originally Posted by scotcher

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. They won't survive by themselves.

It's not like they were doing so well surviving under Stalin's reign of terror

Where was Stalin from again?

Сталин (Джугашвили), Иосиф Виссарионовисч, родился 21 декабря 1879 года в грузинском селении Гори, Тифлисской губернии. Тифлисс - сейчас Тбилиси.

Originally Posted by Lampada

Originally Posted by scotcher

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. They won't survive by themselves.

It's not like they were doing so well surviving under Stalin's reign of terror

Where was Stalin from again?

Сталин (Джугашвили), Иосиф Виссарионовисч, родился 21 декабря 1879 года в грузинском селении Гори, Тифлисской губернии. Тифлисс - сейчас Тбилиси.

И, кстати, Лаврентий Палыч тоже его землячок

И, кстати, Лаврентий Палыч тоже его землячок

Он же вроде мингрел?

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

И, кстати, Лаврентий Палыч тоже его землячок

Он же вроде мингрел?

Ну да - уроженец солнечной Грузии.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors

Just throw them away and they'll die themselves. They won't survive by themselves.

It's not like they were doing so well surviving under Stalin's reign of terror Have you forgotten about the gulag?

Yes, what about it? A reader being unfamiliar with the subject may think that gulag was a special oppression tool designed exclusively for one single republic or nation and not all of them. VT is right - Russia is vital for surviving the satellite countries. They know it but they want just to use Russia for free and at the same time are showing Russia their asses and backstabing it every convenient moment just to prove their "independence". If you are independent - prove that. Get used to the idea that Russia will not help anymore. Stop whining about the Russian oppression and appeal for western media to feel sorry for them. Russia doesn't have to sell gas to Georgia twice cheaper than it does to Europe. I'm a Russian taxpayer and I want my money. I don't want to feed some 'independent nations' just to have NATO bombers closer to my home. It's a rotten way to spend money, after all. We have problems of our own and we too have mouths to feed.

Originally Posted by Ramil

Stop whining about the Russian oppression and appeal for western media to feel sorry for them.

Oh believe me, I do feel sorry for the Russians with Putin as their prez. And perhaps you all should stop whining about the US and show a little empathy before you tell others to do the same. We endured the shock of 9/11 and then we take all the beatings from the rest of the world who think we're imperialist scumbags.

Originally Posted by Ramil

A reader being unfamiliar with the subject may think that gulag was a special oppression tool designed exclusively for one single republic or nation and not all of them.

No I knew the gulags were meant for everyone in the Soviet Union, there weren't special ones for each republic.

And perhaps if Russia would get along with the rest of the world and stop selling fuel to North Korea and what not, you wouldn't HAVE to have "NATO bombers" close to your home.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Ramil

A reader being unfamiliar with the subject may think that gulag was a special oppression tool designed exclusively for one single republic or nation and not all of them.

No I knew the gulags were meant for everyone in the Soviet Union, there weren't special ones for each republic.

And perhaps if Russia would get along with the rest of the world and stop selling fuel to North Korea and what not, you wouldn't HAVE to have "NATO bombers" close to your home.

Still I won't tolerate Russia submitting the will of Uncle Sam. I'd pay for more bombers of our own if US government tries to tell me what to do and whom to deal with. Koreans are not all that bad, you know. Even the Northern ones. I can hadly believe that they pose any threat to anyone. As for the bomb - it's necessary for the ordinary Koreans to think they do and approve the government.

How many to they have? 1, 2, 5? You can't win a war with these, really. Nobody will ever try so put your mind at rest. Korean government is not that crazy. Besides - you have to deliver your warheads to a target by plane or by missile which still don't fly very well. Still - nobody in his right mind will try to bully Korea from now and they will have a chance for independent development.

Originally Posted by Ramil

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Ramil

A reader being unfamiliar with the subject may think that gulag was a special oppression tool designed exclusively for one single republic or nation and not all of them.

No I knew the gulags were meant for everyone in the Soviet Union, there weren't special ones for each republic.

And perhaps if Russia would get along with the rest of the world and stop selling fuel to North Korea and what not, you wouldn't HAVE to have "NATO bombers" close to your home.

Still I won't tolerate Russia submitting the will of Uncle Sam. I'd pay for more bombers of our own if US government tries to tell me what to do and whom to deal with. Koreans are not all that bad, you know. Even the Northern ones. I can hadly believe that they pose any threat to anyone. As for the bomb - it's necessary for the ordinary Koreans to think they do and approve the government.

How many to they have? 1, 2, 5? You can't win a war with these, really. Nobody will ever try so put your mind at rest. Korean government is not that crazy. Besides - you have to deliver your warheads to a target by plane or by missile which still don't fly very well. Still - nobody in his right mind will try to bully Korea from now and they will have a chance for independent development.

See thats the issue that everyone believes, its NOT that the US is telling countries what to do. Its what alot of countries came to the table and agreed upon, the US being one of those nations. Its terrible that the US has to almost always be the first to step forward to say "So and So" is not following the so called agreement we had way back when. If they want it changed then they needed to come to the table before and not after the fact. So its not that US is bullying people, its other countries that are allowing the US to be the "bad guys" because they are willing to stand up for an agreement made several years ago.
I know, I know, it could have been 100 years ago it does not mean you break it without getting with all the countries that agreed to it, and try to make some changes!!!!!

Dang I am American and I cant remember this too clerarly they tell us in kintergarten,

redstripes= the blood that was spilt for the freedom of the country
white stripes for purity
stars for courage of our freedom fighters(to be more specific our fore fathers)
blue I dont remember,....

ok here you go I'm off on a few things
White signifies purity and innocence, Red, hardiness & valour, and Blue, the color of the Chief [the broad band above the stripes] signifies vigilance, perseverance & justice."

Many people also take the red as a reference to the blood of patriots, especially members of the military, who fought for freedom.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
hers somehting neat the flag is sopposed to made to a spefication in such

The basic design of the flag is specified by sections 1 and 2 of Title 4, United States Code (4 U.S.C. §§ 1, 2 (2004)). Executive Order 10834 which may be found as a note to section 1, specifies the proportions of the flag and the arrangement of the stars in the union. [1]. The specification gives the following values:

Hoist (width) of flag: A = 1.0
Fly (length) of flag: B = 1.9
Hoist (width) of Union: C = 0.5385 (7/13, spanning seven stripes)
Fly (length) of Union: D = 0.76 (1.9

Originally Posted by Sir Krist

Tell me please what does the Hammer and sickle stand for? give me details on the Russian flag please.

They stand for unity of the workers and peasants who were considered the ruling classes in the USSR when that simbol was oficially approved in 1918.
Mmm, do you want details on Russian flag or on Soviet flag?

Originally Posted by Тоби

Originally Posted by Ramil

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by Ramil

A reader being unfamiliar with the subject may think that gulag was a special oppression tool designed exclusively for one single republic or nation and not all of them.

No I knew the gulags were meant for everyone in the Soviet Union, there weren't special ones for each republic.

And perhaps if Russia would get along with the rest of the world and stop selling fuel to North Korea and what not, you wouldn't HAVE to have "NATO bombers" close to your home.

Still I won't tolerate Russia submitting the will of Uncle Sam. I'd pay for more bombers of our own if US government tries to tell me what to do and whom to deal with. Koreans are not all that bad, you know. Even the Northern ones. I can hadly believe that they pose any threat to anyone. As for the bomb - it's necessary for the ordinary Koreans to think they do and approve the government.

How many to they have? 1, 2, 5? You can't win a war with these, really. Nobody will ever try so put your mind at rest. Korean government is not that crazy. Besides - you have to deliver your warheads to a target by plane or by missile which still don't fly very well. Still - nobody in his right mind will try to bully Korea from now and they will have a chance for independent development.

See thats the issue that everyone believes, its NOT that the US is telling countries what to do. Its what alot of countries came to the table and agreed upon, the US being one of those nations. Its terrible that the US has to almost always be the first to step forward to say "So and So" is not following the so called agreement we had way back when. If they want it changed then they needed to come to the table before and not after the fact. So its not that US is bullying people, its other countries that are allowing the US to be the "bad guys" because they are willing to stand up for an agreement made several years ago.
I know, I know, it could have been 100 years ago it does not mean you break it without getting with all the countries that agreed to it, and try to make some changes!!!!!

Ah, now you speak about honoring the agreements? Well, let's talk about the Anti-ballistic Missile Treaty of 1972 then and unilateral US quit out of it. Let's talk about Yugoslavia bombings without UN approval (the correspondent resolution came AFTER bombings had started). US does what it wants and where it wants. So if Russia wants to sell nukes to Iran and Korea - well screw the US.

I dont understand your comment.

Its my understanding that the ABM Treaty of 72' was going just fine until the US found Russia in non compliance due to a radar they built within 800 miles of the Russian border. This was in 1983/84.

HOWEVER both countries continued to talk and "re-word" the treaty.
Now your going to say Ronald Reagan said they were going to build Star Wars. Yes, he stated it, BUT even TODAY we still do not have it. So is that non compliance? Or just wording of the agreement?
This went from how many missiles you can have to how do I defend against missiles.


So the point here is that both countries came to the table and re-worded the agreement, and nobody made any threats. So for 30 years Russian and the US had talks, updated the treaty etc....
And yes in 2001 there was a change, but the point is THEY WERE AT THE TABLE.
North Korea is not at ANY TABLE!!

As for Yugoslavia you need to read up on it. It was NATO, meaning many nations not jus the US. But its typical, folks love blaming the US.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legitimacy ... Yugoslavia


And I never said I was against Russia for selling Fuel to Iran or North Korea. In fact I dont see why they cant. All I stated was that the agreement between Russia and Iran was to use the fuel/nuclear abilities for Power and not weapons.
But Iran had a hidden agenda and had 2 more reactors that nobody knew about and Iran did not tell anyone until the US found them several years ago.


Hope this makes sense.

Originally Posted by Тоби

As for Yugoslavia you need to read up on it. It was NATO, meaning many nations not jus the US.

So, it was NATO... US was disagreed I suppose?

Originally Posted by Тоби

I dont understand your comment.

And yes in 2001 there was a change, but the point is THEY WERE AT THE TABLE.
North Korea is not at ANY TABLE!!

Russia was against the "re-wording" as you put it. And still is.

Originally Posted by Тоби

As for Yugoslavia you need to read up on it. It was NATO, meaning many nations not jus the US. But its typical, folks love blaming the US.

Don't start that same old song - "Don't blame us, it's all NATO's fault". We both know just who is de-facto in charge of NATO. We both know that US insisted and other NATO countries just don't argue, because big brother USA says so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legitim..._of_Yugoslavia

So? Is the charter of NATO really takes precedence over the UN charter? Why don't you guys disband UN completely at this point. Not to say that 90% of facts about Kosovo are biased and subject to verification. Add to this a very convenient death of Milošević to turn that whole argumentation into a cr@p.
Batallions of lawyers will prove anything in any court, I'm sure of it. Black would be white, white would be blue, and blue would be red. That doesn't change anything. When it stinks I call this sh|t and don't listen to lawers and CNN.

But Iran had a hidden agenda and had 2 more reactors that nobody knew about and Iran did not tell anyone until the US found them several years ago.

So what? Why US searched for these reactors anyway? That's none of its business, you know. Iran can do anything it wants and is not obliged to report to US president about his activities. And Iran has a right not to tell anyone about anything.

Hope this makes sense.

I don't think so.