Thread: Разные мысли и соображения вокруг событий в Украине

The Ukraine crisis: John Kerry and Nato must calm down and back off

That's a bit unexpected.

Originally Posted by Suobig

Err... Vietnam?

Yeah, I know, it was in my original post that I deleted! Sorry I caused even more distraction by deleting the post. Go on with the Ukraine discussion! in Russian......

Originally Posted by Crocodile

Ты предлагаешь нам поставить в качестве основной системы мастдайки различных конфигураций? Только на виртуальную машину с целью получить first-hand user experience!

Минздрав не рекомендует использование виртуалок на hardware нашего с вами года выпуска. Честно говоря, я не даже не видел их в продаже, хотя некоторые спецслужбы, по слухам, ведут исследования в направлении "фантомных паразитных личностей". Но я не настолько крутой хэккер, чтобы экспериментировать.

Во-первых, заметь, что код всех этих осей был в открытом доступе очень и очень давно, а с тех пор эксклюзивные права на релиз были куплены различными кристально чистыми индивидуумами, пекущимися денно и нощно лишь об общем благе, а код закрыт правами на интеллектуальную собственность. Во-вторых, архитектура этих мастдаек была давным-давно переписана для большей совместимости с централизованно-ориентированными пакетными приложениями.

Да, там есть драйверы и они тащемта регулярно обновляются, но в децентрализованной сети всё это страшно глючит, ограничивая выбор пользователя до, практически, минимума утилит, заботливо вшитых разработчиком, но имеющих бедный интерфейс и ужасную производительность. В третьих, опять-таки из-за закрытости кода, безопасность твоей работы висит на честном слове разработчиков.

Я считаю, что основным требованием к оси должна стать возможность контроля за работой приложений и возможность их полного удаления. Вместо этого, перечисленные тобой мастдайки позволяют установку новых приложений лишь из бедного магазина приложений, полностью контролируемого дистрибьютером. И это агрессивно рекламируется пользователям как фича, гарантирующая полную безопасность. И думать как работает система (ака критически мыслить) при этом вообще не надо.

Исходники первых версий доступны строго по Столлману, так что если вас не устраивают проприетарные форки, используйте любые доступные, коих, слава богу, выше крыши. Буддизм вообще изначально распределенная и свободная система, а ее проприетарная версия далека по популярности от свободных. Для Христианства семейство свободных решений отфорчилось после серии антимонопольных процессов еще в 16 веке. Они менее стабильны, но существенно более производительны и весьма популярны в наиболее развитых странах Европы и США. Ислам же предложил свое децентрализованное решение с открытым кодом в 18 веке и сейчас оно завоевывает все большее количество пользователей.

Originally Posted by Suobig

The Ukraine crisis: John Kerry and Nato must calm down and back off

That's a bit unexpected.

Yeah that's proper journalism.
Remember that this is the paper that Snowden used for his revelations. And Assange.
It's British and it used to be "old" labour, more or less social democrat. Not sure how to define it today. If you want a British paper that's trying to see the bigger picture, it's the Independent or Guardian, personally I prefer the Independent because they have less politically correct nonsense and is more international than the Guardian. Independent was bought by a Russian. Forgot the name but it's the same person who owns the Новая газета paper in Russia. Actually I think he's called Lebedev.

Obviously Russia should be scrutinized for this. Bu if you are realistic, there is certainly no reason to panic or over-react.

Saw in Swedish papers, they are adding emergency funds to the defense budget because of this. That's laughable, for goodness sakes! It's 20 years to late to build any kind of defense at all against Russia, plus it's not even needed for f-cks sake! What a ridiculous waste of money.

Since Sweden buys 60% of its oil from Russia, all that Russia would need to do, would be to turn off the pipeline or stop the tanker, and then they could dictate their terms.

The best "defense" against Russia is to do business with it, learn the language and stop thinking that Russia's internal affairs is our business. And try to snap out of propaganda mode. In the last 10 years, Russia has proven beyond doubts that it is loyal to it's allies, reasonable to negotiate with and not outwardly aggressive. Compare with the record of the USA. There is no need to increase any defense budget in Northern Europe because of events in Ukraine, that's a one-off unique situation!

Mark my words though - there is a new kind of Cold War on the horizon.
It's good for business - they want it.

Originally Posted by Suobig

The Ukraine crisis: John Kerry and Nato must calm down and back off

That's a bit unexpected.

Guardian is an extreme leftist newspaper. They're bloody commies. So that's not unexpected. They quite often support Russian cause.

Originally Posted by bbc

По заявлению минобороны Украины, командующий ЧФ РФ Александр Витко
выдвинул ультиматум украинскому военным в Крыму сложить оружие и сдаться
до 5 утра вторника. Минобороны РФ выступило с опровержением.

Новые фишки всё ещё выставляются на стол. Фишки уже совсем пустые. Strong negotiation skills..

Originally Posted by Ramil

Guardian is an extreme leftist newspaper. They're bloody commies. So that's not unexpected. They quite often support Russian cause.

What are you talking about!! They are not "commies" they are Labour, if even that. Intelligent and educated people read that paper. I think you must have been reading too many comments by certain people posting here recently.

If they sometimes support Russia, it's probably because not everything Russia does is "evil".

Besides, they are really angry with Russia about things like the "gay propaganda laws, Pussy Riot etc.
And Russia is not Commie either, so there is no natural connection even if that had been their inclination.
Last I heard, Putin was a kind of social conservative nationalist. Hardly a communist. If they were communists they should support Cuba, North Korea and Venezuela - which they hardly even pay any notice to.

Originally Posted by Hanna

If they sometimes support Russia, it's probably because not everything Russia does is "evil".

But, Hanna, dear, that's exactly what makes them bloody commies! Every civilized man in the world should know that Russia is PRIME EVIL populated by monsters.

Oh ok
haha, sorry I'm a bit slow sometimes.
I got a headache because I really wanted to read It-Ogos posts and understand his position. But you are not completely committing to one view or another are you?
Is it hard to make up your mind, or do you just feel resigned and despairing in general?

I'm also trying to figure out what Lampada thinks about all this and I think I have an idea based on all the pictures and links she posted. Crocodile as well.

One thing worth noticing about this, is that 2014 shows that Russia is officially back in the game after 20 years.
Syria success, Olympics, and now this, whatever it is.
Krim, with all its Russian history, back in Russian hands. Or....?!

But a new Russia
With less lofty ideology.... less territory....
More high tech, more oil and gas, more conservative values and more corruption and oligarchs.

I think Europe needs Russia for the balance though.

The USA was behaving more and more like a spoiled child, stuffing himself with icecream, throwing his toys around and terrorizing everyone who doesn't give in to his whims. "I want cheap oil", "Everybody must think as I do, or else!", Playing with his toy soldiers where such playing ought not be allowed. Nato "exercises" in places where it just provokes people and makes conflicts worse. There has been nobody to reign in the USA and properly keep tabs on it, for 20 years. In the meantime then USA is a danger not only to others, but also to itself - just look at the state of internal affairs in the USA.

EU was like the lame parent who let the toddler carry on his insane reign of terror and did not have anything to put up - no confidence, to skills, insufficient authority and experience.
The UK is like the little brother who cheers his naughty brother on and makes him even worse.

But Russia is like the more experienced adult who can actually play this game. Was always told at Uni how sharp Russia's diplomats are, and it's true. Things would be 1000 times worse in Syria if not for Russia, and I hope Russia will use its influence for good.

I would feel a lot more positive about the new strong Russia if it wasn't so darn corrupt and had the gangster oligarchs pulling strings behind the scenes.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Oh ok
haha, sorry I'm a bit slow sometimes.
I got a headache because I really wanted to read It-Ogos posts and understand his position. But you are not completely committing to one view or another are you?

Sorry for your headache. My position in a short: before last few days it was rather pro-Russia. Now it is strongly anti-Russia and I fight myself for not making it too personal towards any Russian citizen.

PS Thanks for the patience to my interlocutors.

А в это время на яхте Чёрная Каракатица:

zyalt: В Симферополе все спокойно

zyalt: Важное мнение моей бабушки про Украину

Вежливость захватывает города. В Севастополе в три раза снизилось количество преступлений

Originally Posted by Ramil

Вежливость захватывает города. В Севастополе в три раза снизилось количество преступлений

Инфа 100%?

Честные блоггеры лгать не будут!

Originally Posted by it-ogo

А Йулька и Яценюк... ну кинь ссылки, если ты там что-то интересное увидел. Но дело не в визуальных эффектах.

Вот и вот. Нарыл. Трудно было, больше Януковича показывало.

Санкции со стороны США в отношении российских госструктур вынудят Россию признать невозможность возврата кредитов американским банкам. Об этом заявил советник президента России Сергей Глазьев, передает РИА Новости <http://www.ria.ru/> .

По его словам, санкции являются обоюдоострым оружием, и если в США будут заморожены российские активы, то и пассивы организаций РФ в долларах также будут заморожены. Это, как отметил Глазьев, приведет к тому, что банки и предприятия из РФ не будут возвращать займы американским партнерам.

Глазьев добавил, что если американские власти заморозят счета российских предприятий и граждан, правительство России будет рекомендовать всем продавать казначейские обязательства Соединенных Штатов. Советник президента подчеркнул, что Россия является держателем американских гособлигаций более чем на 200 миллиардов долларов.

Также Глазьев отметил, что если США применят в отношении страны санкции, российская сторона должна будет создать свою расчетно-платежную систему и уйти из доллара в другие валюты. «У нас прекрасные торгово-экономические отношения с нашими партнерами на Востоке и на Юге, и мы найдем способ не только обнулить нашу финансовую зависимость от США, но и выйдем из этих санкций с большой выгодой для себя», — заявил он. Глазьев предупредил, что попытка ввести санкции в отношении России «обернется крахом для финансовой системы США, который повлечет прекращение доминирования США в мировой финансовой системе».


Хм, неужели мои мечты сбудутся и Россия выйдет из доллара?!

I saw on RT, that the new "elected" leaders in Ukraine are rich oligarchs who all appear on the top 10 list of richest people in Ukraine.
Seriously? This just seems like more of the same.

They also showed the houses of Julia Timoshenko and some of her allies that I don't know. She's rich as a goblin. Particularly not a relatively poorly off country.

In my opinion, such people are NOT credible as leaders of a country. Whether it's Ukraine, Russia, USA, Italy or France.

People who become politicians should come from regular backgrounds as much as possible, be elected in a process that does not require money or sponsorship to participate, or because of specialist skills.

I seriously DOUBT that a bunch of oligarchs will bring any meaningful improvement to regular people in Ukraine.

Another thing that Western media is unaware of, or just ignoring, is Crimea's historical ties with Russia, and that it's mostly a fluke that it belongs to Ukraine.
And that Russia are paying millions to Ukraine to keep a base there.
It's not even mentioned.

And as or RT - they write it off as Russian propaganda.

I am going to stop following this now. The hypocrisy in Western media is driving me crazy,
I just hope things will work out for the Ukrainian people.

Originally Posted by Ramil

Вот и вот. Нарыл. Трудно было, больше Януковича показывало.

Nah, Grumpy_01_1681526a.jpg not impressed. Не тот размах.

Юля олигархом была и до выхода в публичную политику, ЕМНИП. Как и Порошенко. Кличку надо форму поддерживать - по этажам бегать, люстры выжимать. У прочих-сравнительно скромненько.

И боюсь, что у нас выбора пока нет - без личной крепости любого политика быстро съедят. Или же нужен Робеспьер с соответствующими методами. Кстати не факт, что это все персональное имущество, многое может принадлежать партии, то есть уйдет потом не к родственникам, а к соратникам. Впрочем, не буду гадать. Теперь-то до этих деятелей руки у общества долго не дойдут, что печально.

Originally Posted by Hanna

I saw on RT, that the new "elected" leaders in Ukraine are rich oligarchs who all appear on the top 10 list of richest people in Ukraine.
Seriously? This just seems like more of the same.

Well, you don't really follow the situation, don't you? The government is temporary, not elected, the elections are coming soon, Julia don't enter the temporary government and there is no way in contemporary Ukraine to be poor and independent in the same time. It is still to be made.

You feel ready for conclusions?

BTW if you don't accept legitimity of even moderately rich people and money-consuming elections, than you should not accept legitimity of any USA president.

Originally Posted by it-ogo

Well, you don't really follow the situation, don't you? The government is temporary, not elected, the elections are coming soon, Julia don't enter the temporary government and there is no way in contemporary Ukraine to be poor and independent in the same time. It is still to be made.

You feel ready for conclusions?

BTW if you don't accept legitimity of even moderately rich people and money-consuming elections, than you should not accept legitimity of any USA president.

No, I have no conclusions, I am trying to understand it.
And I have zero admiration for "democracy" in the USA. And some parts of Europe. It's a joke, and media is in on it.

Whatever will raise living standards for Ukrainians across the country, and not discriminate anyone, is fine by me.
I don't care if it's nationalists, communists, Russia or EU/USA puppets.
As long as it works, and provides stability and improved living conditions for the majority. Not just a clique at the top of society.

But don't trust the EU, please. The EU looks after its own, primarily Northwestern Europe. And runs the errands of the USA. Just because they come and talk on the Maidan and hand out cookies doesn't mean they genuinely care about the lives of regular people in Ukraine. They care about how EU busineses can make money in and out of Ukraine, and about opposing Russia. If it helps some Ukrainians then would be happy with that, but it's not their main motivation.

I'm aware Timoshenko is not in the government. Last I heard she flew to Germany to be treated for some illness after being released from prison. I think she'll want to continue in politics though, she seems very passionate. I know she was accused of corruption, but I don't know if it's true, and what exactly her politics is.