Thread: Life in our countries - "good, bad and ugly"...

Originally Posted by Basil77

Let me guess, did this incident happened in 1989-1999 decade? If so, I could explain the trick. I guess as a foreigner and TV journalist you used to eat at private restaurants and so. The owners of these places prefered to bribe sanitary autorities and do their buisness as they want. At the same times I used to eat at my school cafeteria, uni cafeteria, factory where I worked etc. and never saw a cockroach there. These placeses were still working by USSR standarts and since they were still state-owned they couldn't bribe a sanitary inspectors. In the 2000s these places (I mean state owned places where you could get a dinner) almost died out (with some exceptions, some are still working). I remember when I was asked to do some ingineering work in "super cool" restaurant called " Pirosmani" owned by some Georgian mafia boss in 1999. It was located in a place in Moscow covered by tourists, owner showed me pictures of Bill Clinton and Boris Yeltsin having a dinner there with their signatures and words of gratitude and so. But when I visited the kitchen it was swarming with cockroaches. In 90s in Russia cockroaches were rather sign of a "cool" restaurant because the owner could say to "fvck of" to sanitary inspectors. The ordinary places had to be sterile or be closed by authorities.

Nope. As a matter of fact, I worked за рубли and so actually it was very rare that we went out to the expensive, private restaurants and I only ate at the Astoria one time. More frequently I ate with my Russian colleagues at the commissary на телевидение, and that was where I found the cockroach. I guess that the cooks there either gave the inspectors the фиг в кармане or they just didn't care.

Originally Posted by Deborski

Nope. As a matter of fact, I worked<em> за рубли</em> and so actually it was very rare that we went out to the expensive, private restaurants and I only ate at the Astoria one time. More frequently I ate with my Russian colleagues at the commissary<em> на телевидение,</em> and that was where I found the cockroach. I guess that the cooks there either gave the inspectors the <em>фиг в кармане</em> or they just didn't care.

Ok, I stand corrected then. But still, for me, столовские тевтели на противне с поджареной корочкой с подливкой и гарниром из гречки, которые толстая тётка накладывает тебе лопаточкой с недовольным видом, но, если ты ей улыбнёшься, добавит подливки, are still one of the best food I ever could get.

Originally Posted by Basil77

Ok, I stand corrected then. But still, for me, столовские тевтели на противне с поджареной корочкой с подливкой и гарниром из гречки, которые толстая тётка накладывает тебе лопаточкой с недовольным видом, но, если ты ей улыбнёшься, добавит подливки, are still one of the best food I ever could get.

Our столовая didn't serve that! Lucky you, it sounds delicious! Mostly we had яичница (fried or soft boiled), каша, and some kind of macaroni with sauce. On rare occasions there was meat, usually pork or chicken, but no way to know for sure.

Most of what I ate was stuff I cooked myself. I did most of my shopping at the рынок, but I shopped at the state stores too. Lots of курица, баранина, кинза, укроп, соленые огурцы, и так далее. It was a pretty healthy diet actually. Most of the food I ate was grown by collective farmers in the Ukraine, so there were not a lot of pesticides or preservatives and there was no real "junk food" like we have in America. It took a lot of getting used to, but it wasn't so bad and I was in good physical shape from all the walking that was required.

Originally Posted by Deborski

On rare occasions there was meat, usually pork or chicken, but no way to know for sure.

I usually easily distinguish between pork and chicken, if it's real pork and chicken of course. What were they trying to feed to you?

Originally Posted by Eric C.

I usually easily distinguish between pork and chicken, if it's real pork and chicken of course. What were they trying to feed to you?

Chicken was pretty easy to differentiate from other meats. But pork, not so much. I think there were a couple times when I ate horse-meat. Often the meat was prepared in such a way that it wasn't clear what it was. There were soups with meatballs in it, for example, or meatballs in the macaroni sometimes.

Originally Posted by Deborski

Chicken was pretty easy to differentiate from other meats. But pork, not so much. I think there were a couple times when I ate horse-meat. Often the meat was prepared in such a way that it wasn't clear what it was. There were soups with meatballs in it, for example, or meatballs in the macaroni sometimes.

Yuck! Why do people reduce to things like horse meat cooking?... I think you might even have been lucky to have it as the weirdest sort of meet to eat there, as I'm aware of those cooks adapting even weirder ones for their dishes. A motto at the beginning of one Russian movie says, "only in Moscow, to have a hamburger, you have to catch it first!"

Originally Posted by Eric C.

Yuck! Why do people reduce to things like horse meat cooking?... I think you might even have been lucky to have it as the weirdest sort of meet to eat there, as I'm aware of those cooks adapting even weirder ones for their dishes. A motto at the beginning of one Russian movie says, "only in Moscow, to have a hamburger, you have to catch it first!"

I think it was just a sign of the bad economy back then.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Talk about effective & successful (incorrect) propaganda! I don't think anyone in the the USSR had such idiotic notions about life the the USA, for instance. Or did you?

Reposting a YouTube video that someone linked here a couple years ago -- it's a short film produced by the CIA as a briefing for President Reagan before his visit to the USSR, and purports to show "What the Soviet Media Say About America." (Keep in mind as you watch that it was not originally produced for the general public or for use in school classrooms -- it was a briefing for the White House. In other words, it's supposed to be "objective, accurate, and balanced," and was not actually intended to be anti-Soviet propaganda -- even if it seems that way.)



Two key quotes:

1:50

CIA NARRATOR: "Since the average Soviet citizen has no alternative source of information about the United States, the Soviet version is probably accepted at face value. The Soviet people, however, seem to be curious about America and impressed by its material success."

8:20

CIA NARRATOR: "When it was suggested to a Moscow TV anchorman that Soviet media distorted information about America," he replied:
SOVIET TV NEWS READER: "I think that we are not distorting news. No, I would disagree with you, because we are showing not only the unemployed, we showed millionaires, we showed their private lives, we showed high society, we showed Miss America."

In fairness, I suppose that the "Miss America" pageant technically counts as a representation of America's middle class -- although this may or may not have been apparent to Soviet viewers.

PS. Don't miss the gibberish Cyrillic at 1:30 -- nice work there, CIA-tards!

Originally Posted by Eric C.

I usually easily distinguish between pork and chicken, if it's real pork and chicken of course.

I agree with you, but I've heard that "potential confusability" is the reason that strict Orthodox Jews will not eat chicken (or other bird-meat) with dairy -- because, if bought from an unscrupulous vendor, the "chicken croquettes in sour cream" might turn out to be veal, which would break the no-meat-with-dairy rule. Or, it might even be pork -- which, obviously, is трефной no matter how you cook it.

And as Deborski points out, different meats are often chopped/ground and mixed together when making котлеты or тефтели, so then it's harder to tell.

Originally Posted by Throbert McGee

PS. Don't miss the gibberish Cyrillic at 1:30 -- nice work there, CIA-tards! :fool"

I think it's not a tard kind of guys. That's just a way to outrage someone (a nation in this case) remotely. Americans became skilled in it. It's systematic that's why I'm sure it's cultural and sort of a tradition.

Remember reading about the Mc Donald's that opened in Moscow in the 80s, and how people queued all day to visit. Even that young I thought "how pathetic". They have so much, and they queue for hours for a lousy cheeseburger from a country that would quite happily blow them to smithereens with a nuke.

When I first started teaching English in Moscow -- late August 1993 -- I felt exactly the same way about the McDonalds: "How pathetic!" As you say, McDonalds cheeseburgers really are rather lousy (I feel sorry for anyone whose only conception of a hamburger is based on McDonalds crap!).

But by Christmas-time or so, I finally snapped and went to one of the Moscow McDonalds -- because the floors were so clean, and the people at the cash register didn't growl and yell at you. Plus, there was fresh lettuce -- real, actual lettuce, although in very tiny pieces -- on the Big Macs. These small things -- clean floors, smiling staff, a green vegetable that didn't come from a can -- were very, very welcome after a few months in 1990s Moscow, when I was earning not-very-much-money as an English tutor.

Which is not to say that I made a habit of McDonalds -- you can't eat clean floors and smiles, and the actual food at McDonalds sucks. I nearly always cooked my own food at home to save money, but if I was very hungry and in a hurry, I preferred to buy something from a street vendor if I happened to pass one who was selling hot snacks -- пирожки "с котятами" tasted better than a McDonalds burger, and was a lot cheaper. Even the street-vendor пицца, although not very good back in those days*, was slightly better than a Big Mac.

* Tomato sauce was always too bland, the cheese was usually something Havarti-like, not even close to mozzarella, and there wasn't enough of either the sauce or the cheese -- it was mostly bread.

PS. But I don't agree that the US "would've quite happily blown them to smithereens with a nuke." Nukes are tremendously expensive, my dear, and the whole point of building them is TO NOT USE THEM. Actually delivering the warheads to their destinations -- namely, a kilometer or so above Moscow and other Soviet cities -- would have been, therefore, good money thrown away.

There's a reason, you know, that the airborne nuclear command center of the US during the Cold War was called Operation Looking Glass. (Note that in US English, a зеркало is invariably called a "mirror"; the only time we Merkins ever use the phrase "looking glass" is when we intend it as a reference to Lewis Carroll.)

Originally Posted by Paul G.

I think it's not a tard kind of guys. That's just a way to outrage someone (a nation in this case) remotely. Americans became skilled in it. It's systematic that's why I'm sure it's cultural and sort of a tradition.

But this video, as I said, was not made for Russians to watch -- it was made for the viewing of President Reagan and other Americans who didn't know the Russian alphabet.

I solemnly promise you that the CIA is not nearly clever enough to have deliberately put a mistake in a video just for the purpose of outraging Russians more than 20-30 years later. When the CIA manages to find its own ass, that means they're doing an average job. Every once in a while they do a truly outstanding, spectacular job that actually produces correct information and saves lives on both sides, but that's very rare. On average days, it's "successfully located own ass -- mission accomplished!"

PS. Of course, that's just what I would say if I were secretly working for The Company.

PPS. Now I must kill you all.

Originally Posted by Basil77

...These placeses were still working by USSR standarts and since they were still state-owned they couldn't bribe a sanitary inspectors.

Почему нет? Денег не хватало у директоров? Так инспекторы тоже не дураки: проще взять столько, сколько можно реально, чем закрывать кого-то (кто на следующий день опять откроется на том же месте).

Тараканов помню только в деревенской столовой. Мы участвовали в мероприятии "колхозники помогают студентам собирать урожай" на стороне студентов, а обедали вместе с комбайнёрами. Любое блюдо содержало 1-2 тараканов, они были на виду, и мы (студенты) их вылавливали. Колхозники же, казалось, вообще не смущались. Не зря говорят (обычно про мух, комаров,...): "Это ведь тоже мясо!"
Было это ещё в СССР, кажется, в 1989.

16 People On Things They Couldn’t Believe About America Until They Moved Here | Thought Catalog



"4. Natalia Rekhter

I’m from Russia. Below are a few things I almost always have to explain or discuss with visitors from Russia.

• Why individual houses are so large? We always get into discussion that house is not just a shelter, but also a manifestation of one’s financial achievements.
• Philanthropy. There is no culture of philanthropy in Russia and many view American philanthropy either as a waste of money or as some intricate plot to get some additional benefits.
• People don’t walk places. They go everywhere by a car.
• There is almost no public transportation except in a few large cities. People actually have to have cars to get places. Cars are necessity, not luxury.
• Majority of high and middle schools have sport facilities of very high, almost professional quality.
• Many schools have orchestras, bands, theaters of a very high, almost professional quality. Free.
• Every state has a lot of autonomy.
• President’s salary is comparable with the one of a plastic surgeon.
• President doesn’t automatically become the richest person in the country.
• Majority of things in the US aren’t controlled or regulated by the government.
• Children are expected to leave home when they are 18.
• Students prefer and are expected to live in a dorm and not with parents.
• When relatives visit they often stay in the hotel.
• Many children, even in well to do families, work in fast food, car washes and do a lot of other things to get money and it is not an embarrassment.
• Parents have their babies sleeping in separate rooms almost from the day of their birth. (Russians find #11-15 are particularly absurd, offensive, and egotistical.)
• Many Russians believe that American system of primary and secondary education is very inefficient. As a mother, I have to explain that it is very diverse and essentially even in the poorest districts there are tons of resources available for children who are willing to use them. There are also an opportunity for kids to take advanced and extra advanced classes providing they are willing and able to do the work. And this differentiation is available as early as elementary school.
• How well elderly live, even those on SSI and Medicaid. How many services are available to them.
• How open Americans are about their shortcomings and always ready for self-criticism.
• Millions of people don’t have medical insurance.
• Some hospitals look like five-star hotels.
• Budgets of some hospitals are equal to h/c budgets of small countries.
• Doctors tell their patients everything.
• Return policies and free refill.
• Idea of a liberal art education. In Russia, after high school graduation, a student should decide on vocation: engineer, doctor, teacher, lawyer, accountant, etc. It seems inconceivable to attend a university and then to graduate without a solid specialty. I often have to explain that not knowing what one wants to do after high school is an acceptable norm in US. A student can still acquire marketable skills, expand his or horizons, get a job after graduation, and, what is even more surprising, obtain an advance degree in a totally different field later. Yes, accountant can attend a med school and become a doctor and musician can go for a master degree in computer science. "

Originally Posted by Throbert McGee

There's a reason, you know, that the airborne nuclear command center of the US during the Cold War was called Operation Looking Glass. (Note that in US English, a зеркало is invariably called a "mirror"; the only time we Merkins ever use the phrase "looking glass" is when we intend it as a reference to Lewis Carroll.)

It is said that Lewis Carroll based his classic "Through the Looking Glass" on his own travels in Russia. I am not sure it was ever confirmed if this is true, but it would not surprise me in the slightest and in fact, in that context, Alice and the Cheshire Cat and the Mad Hatter all take on an even fuller dimension.

А закупившись пирожками с котятами, ты бы мог заявиться в МакДональдс, помахать у них пирожками перед носом, и подразнить:

"А вы кушайте сами пирожки с волосами!" (такая поэзия)

President doesn’t automatically become the richest person in the country

Ну, у нас, в общем-то, тоже.

Majority of things in the US aren’t controlled or regulated by the government

Откуда она знает, что, на самом деле, controlled, а что - нет?
В любом случае, в России контроль правительства слабее.

Many Russians believe that American system of primary and secondary education is very inefficient. As a mother, I have to explain that it is very diverse and essentially even in the poorest districts there are tons of resources available for children who are willing to use them. There are also an opportunity for kids to take advanced and extra advanced classes providing they are willing and able to do the work. And this differentiation is available as early as elementary school.

Одно другому не противоречит. Чему здесь русские удивляются?

Originally Posted by Throbert McGee

Reposting a YouTube video that someone linked here a couple years ago -- it's a short film produced by the CIA as a briefing for President Reagan before his visit to the USSR, and purports to show "What the Soviet Media Say About America." (Keep in mind as you watch that it was not originally produced for the general public or for use in school classrooms -- it was a briefing for the White House. In other words, it's supposed to be "objective, accurate, and balanced," and was not actually intended to be anti-Soviet propaganda -- even if it seems that way.)



Two key quotes:

1:50


8:20


In fairness, I suppose that the "Miss America" pageant technically counts as a representation of America's middle class -- although this may or may not have been apparent to Soviet viewers.

PS. Don't miss the gibberish Cyrillic at 1:30 -- nice work there, CIA-tards! :fool"

That is a very interesting video. It causes mixed feelings, but the primary one is, "darn, it doesn't even take freedom of press to be made and shown to the public!" xD The Soviet propaganda failed to dig out any real problem the U.S. had at that point, and instead it was "exposing" the same naive and foolish stereotypes (racism, militarism, the anti-commie policies, etc.) over and over again. I think even most of the Soviets who watched it didn't believe it, as they were starting to learn more about the "evil capitalism" on their own. (whatever it sounds like, that 1.5 mile long line before the Soviet only McDonald's kind of proved that).

Now, was anything like that video, exposing the "America's view on the USSR" broadcasted to the public in the USSR? It seems not, for the Soviet authorities were really afraid of speaking aloud about any hypothetic problem that country might've had, not to mention the real problems they had, that could've easily been exposed. That was the reason anything that diverged from "everything's super awesome in our communist state" was banned from any media sources. If I'm being incorrect here, please share a proof link, anyone. =))

З українського Forbes за власним бажанням пішло 14 журналістів - Новини - Український тиждень


"14 журналістів українського Forbes у вівторок написали заяви про звільнення через "намагання змінити редакційну політику"."

Originally Posted by Lampada

З українського Forbes за власним бажанням пішло 14 журналістів - Новини - Український тиждень


"14 журналістів українського Forbes у вівторок написали заяви про звільнення через "намагання змінити редакційну політику"."

Looks like TOP-13 on the Forbes list =)))