Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: Kipling's word shortening

  1. #1
    Старший оракул CoffeeCup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snowbearia
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    10

    Kipling's word shortening

    Reading Kipling's stories I've met words which beginning is replaced with an apostrophe:

    'scruciating = excruciating
    'scuse = excuse
    'vantage = advantage

    these were easy to recognise but I can't figure out what 'satiable stands for?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kipling
    But there was one Elephant — a new Elephant — an Elephant's Child — who was full of 'satiable curtiosity, and that means he asked ever so many questions.
    The curtiosity is obviously (to me) stands for curiosity though I've no idea why Kipling used such a spelling.
    So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish

  2. #2
    Властелин
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    The peoples state of New Jersey
    Posts
    1,137
    Rep Power
    17
    Quote Originally Posted by CoffeeCup View Post
    Reading Kipling's stories I've met words which beginning is replaced with an apostrophe:

    'scruciating = excruciating
    'scuse = excuse
    'vantage = advantage

    these were easy to recognise but I can't figure out what 'satiable stands for?


    The curtiosity is obviously (to me) stands for curiosity though I've no idea why Kipling used such a spelling.
    Insatiable?

    Scott

  3. #3
    Почтенный гражданин Demonic_Duck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Cambridge, UK
    Posts
    304
    Rep Power
    6
    Yes, presumably "insatiable", although actually "satiable" means the exact opposite of insatiable.

    "'Scuse" is fairly commonly used colloquially, as in the phrases "'scuse me", "'scuse my French", etc.
    Демоническая Утка
    Носитель английского языка, учу русский язык.
    Пожалуйста, исправьте мои сообщения!

  4. #4
    Старший оракул CoffeeCup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snowbearia
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    10
    Thanks!
    So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish

  5. #5
    Старший оракул CoffeeCup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snowbearia
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    10
    What about 'Stute?
    Quote Originally Posted by Kipling
    Till at last there was only one small fish left in all the sea, and he was a small 'Stute Fish, and he swam a little behind the Whale's right ear, so as to be out of harm's way.
    So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish

  6. #6
    Moderator Lampada's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    СССР -> США
    Posts
    17,620
    Rep Power
    31
    astute
    "...Важно, чтобы форум оставался местом, объединяющим людей, для которых интересны русский язык и культура. ..." - MasterАdmin (из переписки)



  7. #7
    Старший оракул CoffeeCup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snowbearia
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    10
    astute
    Thanks!
    So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish

  8. #8
    Завсегдатай chaika's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Чапелхилловка, NC USA
    Posts
    1,987
    Rep Power
    16
    Probably not a good idea to think that these abbreviations are in general use. They aren't, and I doubt if they were even when he was writing. The one you'll hear nowadays is 'scuse me. But if someone knew the meaning of the words insatiable, curiosity, and astute, they would not abbreviate them. But my curiosity is piqued and I'd like to know the context in which you found these things!

  9. #9
    Старший оракул Seraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    782
    Rep Power
    14
    Just so stories? http://www.boop.org/jan/justso/ http://www.freeclassicaudiobooks.com...ks/JustSo/mp3/ Plain Tales from the Hills? LibriVox

    Another author from Victorian times good for a chuckle, http://librivox.org/three-men-in-a-b...rome-k-jerome/

  10. #10
    Старший оракул CoffeeCup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snowbearia
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    10
    Yes, these are from the Kipling's "Just so stories" published in1902. Mostly such words are used in fixed phrases:

    'Stute fish is referred to a character from "How the whale got his throat"

    'Scruciating idle is used to describe the camel from "How the camel got his hump"

    'Satiable curtiosity is used to describe the elephant's child from "The elephant's child"
    When the elephant's child got his new nose he got some advantages referred to only as 'vantage.
    'Scuse me was used by the elephant's child only.
    So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish

  11. #11
    Завсегдатай Throbert McGee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairfax, VA (Фэйрфэкс, ш. Виргиния, США)
    Posts
    1,591
    Rep Power
    36
    Quote Originally Posted by chaika View Post
    Probably not a good idea to think that these abbreviations are in general use. They aren't, and I doubt if they were even when he was writing. The one you'll hear nowadays is 'scuse me.
    I think the only occasion one might hear 'satiable or 'scruciating (outside of Kipling!) would be from a young child who had heard an adult use the word and was trying to imitate it. In this case, "imitating" the word not quite successfully! So, Kipling was an adult imitating a little kid imitating an adult.

    Sample dialogue with my nephew, who recently turned four:

    NEPHEW: Omple Rob, I got a new LEGO for my birfday! Guess what it is?!?! It's a BULLDOZER!!!!!
    ME: A bulldozer? [confused voice] Oh, that's like a boy cow, right?
    NEPHEW: NO!! Not a bull!! A bulldozer's a 'struction machine!!
    ME: Okay, then, let's put the bulldozer together.
    NEPHEW: Wait! [with immense gravity] Omple Rob, FIRST we gotta lookit da 'structions...

    (Note that to him, 'struction can mean either "construction" or "instruction." Young children often have difficulty with unstressed prefixes, especially when the unstressed prefix comes before the stressed syllable. Sometimes, my nephew will pronounce "the instructions" as "dun 'structions" -- i.e., "dun" = "the-in." So in that case, he's not totally dropping the prefix in-, but instead the prefix becomes "elided" to the definite article.)

    P.S. I agree with what others have said, that 'scuse me is очень часто встречается even in the speech of highly-educated adults.
    Говорит Бегемот: "Dear citizens of MR -- please correct my Russian mistakes!"

  12. #12
    Завсегдатай Throbert McGee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairfax, VA (Фэйрфэкс, ш. Виргиния, США)
    Posts
    1,591
    Rep Power
    36
    BTW, I think that the "lazy" pronunciation 'scuse me is most commonly heard when the meaning is Дайте пройти, пожалуйста -- for example, when you're trying to exit a crowded bus or metro: "'Scuse me, trying to get off. 'Scuse me! 'Scuse me, please! Thanks! 'Scuse me..."

    But when the meaning is more like Можно задать вам вопрос?, people will tend to use careful pronunciation: "Excuse me, do you know where I could find a drugstore nearby?"

    P.S. The all-time greatest example of "'Scuse me, 'scuse me, 'scuse me..." in the sense of дайте пройти (starting at 1:14 mark) -- from Tim Burton's classic 1985 comedy Pee-Wee's Big Adventure, when Наш Герой accidentally walks into a motorcycle bar filled with Hell's Angels. (Also, don't miss the "ventriloquism" at 2:02, when the bikers are trying to decide the best way to kill him...)
    Говорит Бегемот: "Dear citizens of MR -- please correct my Russian mistakes!"

  13. #13
    Старший оракул CoffeeCup's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snowbearia
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    10
    Quote Originally Posted by Throbert McGee View Post
    I think the only occasion one might hear 'satiable or 'scruciating (outside of Kipling!) would be from a young child who had heard an adult use the word and was trying to imitate it. In this case, "imitating" the word not quite successfully! So, Kipling was an adult imitating a little kid imitating an adult.

    Sample dialogue with my nephew, who recently turned four:

    NEPHEW: Omple Rob, I got a new LEGO for my birfday! Guess what it is?!?! It's a BULLDOZER!!!!!
    ME: A bulldozer? [confused voice] Oh, that's like a boy cow, right?
    NEPHEW: NO!! Not a bull!! A bulldozer's a 'struction machine!!
    ME: Okay, then, let's put the bulldozer together.
    NEPHEW: Wait! [with immense gravity] Omple Rob, FIRST we gotta lookit da 'structions...

    (Note that to him, 'struction can mean either "construction" or "instruction." Young children often have difficulty with unstressed prefixes, especially when the unstressed prefix comes before the stressed syllable. Sometimes, my nephew will pronounce "the instructions" as "dun 'structions" -- i.e., "dun" = "the-in." So in that case, he's not totally dropping the prefix in-, but instead the prefix becomes "elided" to the definite article.)

    P.S. I agree with what others have said, that 'scuse me is очень часто встречается even in the speech of highly-educated adults.
    In Kipling's stories "How the first letter was written" and "How the alphabet was made" there is a little girl Taffy who talks with many words shortened this way, (oh, and she is the only who talks this way in these stories):

    'splaining - explaining
    'fended - offended
    s'prise - surprise
    etc.

    So it seems that using such a shortening Kipling did wish to imitate childish talking or to narrate these stories to children in their own children's language.
    So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish

  14. #14
    Подающий надежды оратор
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    35
    Rep Power
    6
    It's just the English way of pronouncing long words. The English have a reputation for having bad teeth. When you have an inferior set of teeth at your disposal you can't be expected to say every syllable in words like Cholmondeley and supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, you naturally end up saying "chumley" and "soufflé" instead.

Similar Threads

  1. A word! My cottage for a word!
    By radomir in forum Translate This!
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: August 14th, 2009, 10:53 AM
  2. Word to Word translation
    By penguinhead in forum Getting Started with Russian
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: April 12th, 2009, 10:39 PM
  3. What's the word for...?
    By JoeyJoeJo in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: November 6th, 2007, 11:11 AM
  4. just a word
    By Орчун in forum Translate This!
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: March 8th, 2007, 05:21 PM
  5. I keep seeing this word.....
    By saibot in forum Translate This!
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: March 30th, 2005, 07:23 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Russian Lessons                           

Russian Tests and Quizzes            

Russian Vocabulary