Thread: Travel Blog; CIS/ex-USSR countries (i.e. Russian speaking)

Originally Posted by Basil77

Hanna, have you desided already about your Russian courses? Actually I've just realised that I can ask my aunt about that - she teaches students at Vitebsk Medical Institute Latin and French and they have plenty of foreign students so she should know a few things on this subject. If you still haven't decided about Russian courses I could call her right now and ask about this subject.

No, and I would be very grateful if you could find help me find out! I think there must be more available than what I have been able to find while searching online. My findings are not very impressive.
There seems to be only a few unaffiliated course in Belarus. The price is very low - I am sure you'd pay twice or three times that, anywhere in Russia and probably 10 times more in Moscow. But it's the same language, no different accent and probably equally well qualified teachers, and I already have a visa.

I want an intensive course of maybe 3 weeks. All that I found is in Minsk - but any location is fine for me. I think I'd need to SPEAK with these places to see if they can accommodate my situation or not. Belarus is a tad bureacratic. If they can't, then I'll do a course in Russiar, either now, or later.

I found only these in Belarus:
http://lider.by/courses-description/...#comment-26499
Курсы русского языка для иностранцев.
MSLU INTERNATIONAL - For Foreign Students - The Division of Russian as a Foreign Language

Originally Posted by Ann

Hanna: How late do you stay out in the evening? Are there any businesses such as cafes or bookstores that close late (10 or 11 p.m.)?

Yes - they close quite late.... Later than I am used to. But shops are not open as late as 11. More like 8 or 9. And remember, sightseeing is exhausting. After 7-8 hours you've had a pretty full day.

Originally Posted by Marcus

Hanna, have you noticed any differences between Russian spoken in Moldova, Ukraine, Belarus? Are there differences between textbooks and living speech? What was new for you in Russian language? Have you changed your views on Russian language?

No I can't tell any difference between the speech. In Moldova, most of the people who spoke Russian with me were probably not native speakers. But I could not really tell. Although in fact, a lot of people in Moldova are born in Russian speaking places of the ex-USSR - so I guess that makes them native speakers. But I think that maybe, like you said, Belarussians speak a tiny bit more slowly and are maybe expecting grammar to be at least reasonably close (mine is not...)
I am not sure how good I can ever get at Russian. It's just so very difficult.

There is a bit of difference I think between Belarussian people and Ukrainians. Ukrainians felt a bit "warmer" and more sponteneous. Whereas the Belarussians feel more organised, proper and more shy. But it is only a very slight difference and I think it's just a very faint reflection of the same North/South mentality divide that exists elsewhere in Europe - for example if you compare French with Spanish people, Germans with Italians etc.

The people in Odessa were the most fun! For example, one woman came up and asked if she could give me a hug, because she thought I looked lonely walking around sightseeing on my own!

Older people seem to still feel unity with the other ex-Soviet countries, at least the Russian speaking ones. They talk a lot about how things were in the USSR in a positive tone. On the train I sat next to a little group that was chatting. It consisted of a Belarussian and Ukrainian woman respectively (they were old friends) and a man who was Russian. A guy from Uzbekistan and me were not participating in the disussion. Listening to what they were saying, there was no feeling that they were from 3 different countries at all, and I don't think there was any major difference in how they were speaking.

Originally Posted by Eric C.

And, by the way, Hanna, don't forget to post here your impressions on visiting that small town near Gomel (desirably with photos), I'm really looking forward to that. =)

I was meaning to do it yesterday, but I did not get around to it. Looking out from the train window, I can say that the small villages look very similar to what I saw in Ukraine, Moldova and Romania. The houses in Belarus were in a somewhat better state of repair than in Ukraine or Moldova. Most looked better maintained, painted etc. It is not rich, but nobody is starving, and everyone has all the clothes they need, and things like a mobile phone. I am aware that I am (undeservedly) "richer" than most people from around here, and the last thing I want to do is be vulgar about that, or treat anything like a spectacle. I am not a rich person in Western Europe, just reasonably "well off" at the moment. I too have been broke and worried about the future at times in my life. I would be extremely cautious about how and when I go to a village, so it would be natural and in a respectful way. For example viewing handicraft or a museum in a village would be an opportunity. Just turning up and starting to photograph, without being able to speak Russian well enough to explain my interest, would feel wrong. So I put it off for the time being. I take your point that there may be poverty in these villages though. But bear in mind that these poor people are the biggest supporters of the current regime in Belarus because it helped keep the worst of post-communism decline at bay for old and rural people.

Basil77 has been in a Belarussian village I think - maybe he can tell you.

Originally Posted by Hanna

No, and I would be very grateful if you could find help me find out!

Hanna, sorry I'm only for today have been able to call my aunt (she was at her dacha on holidays and didn't cared to charge her cell-phone). I'm afraid the group Russian lessons they have in their institute for foreign students wouldn't suit you. They are for future doctors and too focused on medical terminology. Some Russian teachers from their institute are giving private tutoring in Russian for foreign students for rather low prices though.

Basil77 has been in a Belarussian village I think - maybe he can tell you.

Yes, I have been in many Belorussian villages many times and even have some relatives living there. I must confirm that your impression is right: Belarus rural areas are in somewhat better shape than Russian and Ukrainian ones because Lukashenko's goverment have strong farmers-supporting programs and Russian and Ukrainian farmers are at their own - facing the savage grin of capitalism. But I doubt that brainwashed dude Eric C. would belive that.

And, by the way, Hanna, don't forget to post here your impressions on visiting that small town near Gomel (desirably with photos), I'm really looking forward to that. =)

Some pictures of Victory Day in Gomel, Belarus

Thank you for checking Basil77!

Whiteknight, thanks for posting the links! I'll be sure to check them tomorrow.

Bureacracy is another obstacle for taking the course here. Bureacracy is taken extremely seriously here, and lots of forms, certificates etc are needed to enroll in the course at Minsk State University. Not sure how willing they might be to compromise. I don't have all the stuff with me that's needed.

I have arrived in Minsk. I am irritated because every time I travel anywhere, I mess it up because it's so hard to discuss the complicated matters surrounding train departures. Today, for example, the lady in the ticket booth did not sell me a ticket to the train I wanted. I think she said it wasn't running. But after I bought the (rather expensive) ticket to the train she suggested, and discovered it was for an overnight train, I also noticed that the first train, the one I wanted, was actually at the platform. No idea why she wouldn't sell me a ticket! I ended up going on that train instead, paying a MUCH lower price (extremly low) for the ticket to Minsk. The overnight ticket was wasted.
This happened because my skills in Russian are not good enough to have a discussion about train issues.
Also, the arrival of the train to Minsk was 4 hours later than what the CIS official timetable site claimed it would be, yet it did not appear to be held up anywhere.

On the train I sat with a very kind and funny Belarussian lady, and a Ukrainian guy who lives in Minsk.
I really enjoyed hearing her view on life in Belarus etc. She was quite a committed communist and felt that the Lukashenko regime was letting down the ideals of the USSR. Very passionate. The Ukrainian guy generally thought that things are crap both in Ukraine and Belarus and couldn't understand why anyone would want to go on holiday to either country. His main point was that a visit to the Ukrainian countryside is necessary to understand the problems in Ukraine. I am sure he's right. On account of their different outlooks, the woman and the guy were quabbling all the way on the train. The guy helped me get to the flat by taxi and offered to meet up tomorrow for some sightseeing.

The Ukrainian guy said he'd lived in Scotland for 3 years. But his English was very bad and it is hard to imagine how he could have managed. His English was a tiny bit better than my Russian, nothing more. He was a bricklayer.

Apparently Minsk was 80% destroyed during the war, and pretty much all buildings are from the 50s and 60s.

At the moment I am in a flat on a street with 3 names: Lenina/Skoriny/Independence. It's the main street in Minsk.
Everybody seems to be using the name based on their preferences. The flat is large and has all amenities to wash, cook etc.

Yeah ) our bureaucracy is really hard to skip)). I surprised that you have faced it just now. But don't loose your optimism. If you like I can ask my acquaintance, Deutch and English teacher from Linguistic University. Maybe she would like to give you some Russian lessons... At any rate she can advice something or somebody to you.

Yeah... Who knows... This is supposed to be a "lux" flat though, and it is very clean and generally in a very good state. I can't imagine they'd let something like that happen if they could avoid it... I am thinking that maybe the water tank for the building is empty for some reason, or there is work being done on the water pipes somewhere nearby. This flat is on the Skoriny Avenue although the entrance is from a small side street.

No water for over an hour now, and because of my train drama yesterday, I have not eaten for almost 24 hours. So I am off to buy some food, detergent and some other things I need.

If the water is not back when I return, I'll text the owner and ask if he knows what's going on.
Today I was going to wash all my dirty clothes, so I do need some water....

This building is a 1950s, rather elegant block of flats. Does anyone know whether houses of this type get the water from a water tank in the building, or if it is coming remotely from somewhere else without being stored in the building first? Neither the hot water, nor the cold water is working.

Broadband in Minsk

As I know almost all buildings in Minsk are connected to the central plumbing system, and almost all of them are supplied by hot water from big heat stations thrue plumbing system under the city. If both hot and cold water aren't working it's more likely means that some failure happend in the building and plumbers cut-off both of waters, because they don't exactly know which pipe has failed.
I'm sure that everything will be ok soon. You can give me the number of building, I'll call to the service and ask wat's happened, and when the trouble will be fixed.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Yeah... Who knows... This is supposed to be a "lux" flat though, and it is very clean and generally in a very good state. I can't imagine they'd let something like that happen if they could avoid it... I am thinking that maybe the water tank for the building is empty for some reason, or there is work being done on the water pipes somewhere nearby. This flat is on the Skoriny Avenue although the entrance is from a small side street.

No water for over an hour now, and because of my train drama yesterday, I have not eaten for almost 24 hours. So I am off to buy some food, detergent and some other things I need.

If the water is not back when I return, I'll text the owner and ask if he knows what's going on.
Today I was going to wash all my dirty clothes, so I do need some water....

If there is no any water: hot and cold, most probably some work being done on the water pipes. But there is one specific issue with hot water you can meet these days. The city wide hot water supply is generally checked twice a year in spring and fall. During these checks the hot water became cold. If the checks past successfully the water became hot again after a week, but if the checks failed the lack of hot water remains until the failure patched (maybe for a few weeks). For an example, next checking in Novosibirsk starts at the May 16.

This morning there was a short electricity outage, for about 15 minutes, in the building I am staying in.
And at the moment, there is no water coming from any of the taps. Is this a problem across Minsk, or do you think there is something wrong in this building?
I was just about to start washing my clothes and remove some spots.
The flat is great though - for some reason they gave me a much bigger and better flat for the same price.

Originally Posted by Hanna

The flat is great though - for some reason they gave me a much bigger and better flat for the same price.

)) maybe it's the compensation for the water and electricity absence?

Actually the profilactical hot water cut-offs have began in Minsk. If it happend with your building, you should be ready to live without hot shower for two weeks at least. But I think it's common plumbing fail.

Thanks for giving me information about this and the kind offers of help!
The water is back now. I called the agent earlier, and asked about it - he said not to worry, it is municipal maintenance work being done, and it is very rare.

I am so lucky with this flat!

It is really large for one person and it is SUPER central in Minsk! The street is actually different than I thought: Kozlova. For those who know Minsk, it's called "Kozlova". The metro station is called "Ploszhad Pobedy" - although a different Belarussian name is used in the metro itself.

More on this very cool city soon! It is very interesting to compare it with Kiev. They are much more different than I had expected.

ALSO: I have been drinking the tap water in Ukraine and Belarus. Not always, but a few times. Nothing has happened, so I assume it's ok? Does anyone know?

I pulled out a set of postcard of Minsk and a small book about the Trinity Suburb to see if there were any photos of Kozlova. No. They were gifts from Irina and Tania when they worked here (God, 8 years ago?). The "Minsk 4" have split up and only Anya still lives there. She just had a baby so she's rather busy and can't be a tour guide.
I tried.

Tap water is ok to drink it sometimes, but it's not recommended to drink it forever because it contains cholrine (Ch). So, we are using water filters.
I have read your "blog" about the trip - it's quite interesting, how the foreigners see CIS. This summer we (me and n8m, in fact we are friends and classmates) are going to America, so it could be interesting to compare your impression about CIS (place where you have not been ever before) and our impression about America (place where we have not been ever before too).
Waiting for your impressions about Minsk, with photos of course

Я так глупая... Пропала карту Виса...

Nobody stole it from me, I am almost certain... Just dropped it because I was too paranoid to keep it in my wallet, and I must have dropped it from where I was keeping it. Two cards lost already on this trip!! Only one card left and that is a Mastercard credit card which I don't like to use, and Mastercards are less commonly used than Visa in Belarus.

And I haven't lost my wallet or any cards for 9 years. Unbelievable that I am so stupid as to do it on this holiday which I have been looking forward to for a long time.

Isn't it ironic how stupid and clumsy you can sometimes be at the worst possible times.
So I have had to spend hours trying to organise for anal banks to send replacement cards to me.

So I spent a fortune on mobile calls abroad, just to go though the same security checks over and over again.. Talking with call centre muppets... That's enough ranting though, and at the end of the day it's my own fault, for being clumsy.

Hopefully at least one of the cards should reach me.

По этому мне надо остаться в Минске через 1-2 недель... Но мне очень нравиться этот город. Он очень интересный, опрятный, зелёный и прекрасный. Люди здесь добры, но не так смешной как в Одессе!

Сегодня я посетила офис "БелИнтурист" в Минске.

At the BelIntourist office I had strong feeling that I was one of very few international visitors that day. They asked me what I thought about the country and how I had managed to find the office.
I gave polite answers to the questions, but the truth is that there is very little tourist information available about Belarus in English. And that which exists is very hard to find. Belintourist has a lot of work to do. They should start by translating ALL of their site into GOOD English. Currently only half of it is translated, and the translations are not done by native speakers.

Searching for Belarus and tourism related phrases often leads you to US departments "information" pages which paint a very black picture of Belarus as a tourist destination: There is radiation from Chernobyl, the KGB can come into your hotel room when you are out and search your bags... There is no hot water sometimes, everyone is really poor... foreigners are stopped on the street and asked for documentation... they can be taken to the police station for interrogation if the police feels like it... And so on and so forth... Of course I have had no such problems, because it simply isn't true. But anyone who reads this is very unlikely to want to go to Belarus (I hadn't read it until now) BelIntourist needs to search optimise their pages so that THEIR official information comes up on the top when people google these tourism related phrases.

Another funny thing at the tourist office was that they couldn't answer an incredibly basic question about registration for foreigners - what the rules are. I definitely would have expected them to know that. They DID find out for me, but it was very surprising that they didn't already know.

Originally Posted by Hanna

Я так глупая... Потеряла карту Виза...

Sad to hear that. I hope you have called your bank and asked them to block it to prevent another person to use it, at some places you can pay with it without entering a pin-code, they ask only your signature and it can be easily faked.

По_этому мне надо остаться в Минске еще на 1-2 недели... Но мне очень нравит_ся этот город. Он очень интересный, опрятный, зелёный и прекрасный. Люди здесь добрые, но не такие весёлые, как в Одессе!
Сегодня я посетила офис "БелИнтурист" в Минске.

Hanna, I'm very sorry to hear that you've encountered those troubles during your trip, but I hope you'll succesfully solve your problems soon. As they say, big troubles don't last long and small ones don't worth mentioning. Don't be sad!

Originally Posted by Basil77

Я так глупая... Потеряла карту Виза...

And I сan't even SAY it correctly. Oh dear... I said that incorrectly to several people today. Ooooh how embarrassing! Feel incredibly stupid today.

Thanks for the encouragement though!

My trip have been reqally amazing though - so interesting, and none of the countries in Eastern Europe were like I thought they'd be. Someday soon for a holiday I'll definitely go back to Ukraine, I liked it a lot there. I like Belarus too but it is quite different from Ukraine.


Wh

Originally Posted by Basil77

юди здесь добрые, но не такие весёлые, как в Одессе!

Why is смешной wrong?Also, "people" is singular in English, but I guess from this correction that it is plural in Russian! More logical really.

Originally Posted by Hanna

And I сan't even SAY it correctly. Oh dear...

Don't be so harsh to yourself, we're all learning here. Russian isn't even your second language! I bet my posts in English look incredibly stupid in the eyes of native speakers and people like you who are fluent in it. And I can't even speak it at all, only read and write after almost 20 years of learning!
As for the verbs пропала/потеряла: they are quite similar to English missing/lost:
My credit cart is missing - Моя кредитка пропала.
I lost my credit card - Я потеряла кредитку.
You can't say in English either: "I miss my credit card", at least it sounds funny, like you have some feelings to a piece of plastic . But in Russian it doesn't sounds funny, just wrong. And I think everyone have understand that you were trying to say.

Why is смешной wrong?Also, "people" is singular in English, but I guess from this correction that it is plural in Russian! More logical really.

Yes, люди is plural in Russian. Also this noun hasn't a singular form. To say strictly it has, but with completely different root: человек. Singular: человек Plural: люди
Смешные isn't grammatically wrong, that's why I made the correction in green. But смешные sounds like you can laugh at them like they are some clowns, not with them. So I've suggested that you wanted to say a slightly different thing, sorry if I was wrong.

Basil - don't be harsh on yourself - your English is very good.

Scott

Originally Posted by Basil77

Don't be so harsh to yourself, we're all learning here. Russian isn't even your second language! I bet my posts in English look incredibly stupid in the eyes of native speakers and people like you who are fluent in it. And I can't even speak it at all, only read and write after almost 20 years of learning!
As for the verbs пропала/потеряла: they are quite similar to English missing/lost:
My credit cart is missing - Моя кредитка пропала.
I lost my credit card - Я потеряла кредитку.
You can't say in English either: "I miss my credit card", at least it sounds funny, like you have some feelings to a piece of plastic . But in Russian it doesn't sounds funny, just wrong. And I think everyone have understand that you were trying to say.

Yes, люди is plural in Russian. Also this noun hasn't a singular form. To say strictly it has, but with completely different root: человек. Singular: человек Plural: люди
Смешные isn't grammatically wrong, that's why I made the correction in green. But смешные sounds like you can laugh at them like they are some clowns, not with them. So I've suggested that you wanted to say a slightly different thing, sorry if I was wrong.

"смешной" means funny, ridiculous. So it means that you want to laugh at them when you see them. Did you mean that? "люди" is in modern language the plural of человек. And grammatically it is plural. Люди, людей, людям...
English often does not distinguish between transitive and untransitive verbs while Russian always does.