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I do not know what this is about.Originally Posted by Боб Уайтман
It was difficult to translate some parts fo the verses : Некоторые части стихов было трудно переводить. If I am not mistaken that this one is right?
Some parts of the verses were difficult to translate (for translation) : Некоторые части стихов были трудны для перевода: Here I do not understand how трудны is formed up. Is that somekind of adjective form used to refer to the genitive case?
Иди и учи русский!
What exactly confuses you in my explanation?
Yep!
Full form - трудный (masc.), трудная (fem.), трудное (neut.), трудные (plural).
Short from - труден (masc.), трудна (fem.), трудно (neut.), трудны (plural) - here you need plural because "некоторые части" are in plural.
We usually use short forms of adjectives in the predicate position (i.e.: they are difficult for translation - они трудны для перевода). And it has nothing to do with genitive, since the short forms do not decline at all. They never precede a noun. Another possible gap in your grammar- full and short adjectival forms.
More examples:
Этот рассказ труден для перевода.
Эта книга трудна для перевода.
Это стихотворение трудно для перевода.
Эти рассказы (книги, стихотворения) трудны для перевода.
What exactly confuses you in my explanation?
Yep!
Full form - трудный (masc.), трудная (fem.), трудное (neut.), трудные (plural).
Short from - труден (masc.), трудна (fem.), трудно (neut.), трудны (plural) - here you need plural because "некоторые части" are in plural.
We usually use short forms of adjectives in the predicate position (i.e.: they are difficult for translation - они трудны для перевода). And it has nothing to do with genitive, since the short forms do not decline at all. They never precede a noun. Another possible gap in your grammar
More examples:
Этот рассказ труден для перевода.
Эта книга трудна для перевода.
Это стихотворение трудно для перевода.
Эти рассказы (книги, стихотворения) трудны для перевода.
What confuses me is why we need to use the short form of the adjective. For example what is the exact difference in meaning between the below sentences;
Эта книга трудна для перевода VS Эту книгу трудно переводить
I think the first one means,
The book is difficult for translations. In that sentences the sort form of the adjective which is refers to the book.
And the second exaplme means,
Difficult to translate that book (I changed the word order to indicate i want to refer to the noun) So here the adjective refers to the verb.
Correct?
Иди и учи русский!
Well, they're virtually identical, they convey the same meaning just in two different ways. A particular sitiation might incline you to choose one phrase over the other though.
For example, you've started translating the book and work your way through that. Here you can use both phrases.
If you haven't started translating the book and you just point out that you think the book is difficult to translate, well, you can still use both phrases, but the second one is not really good for this case.
I better rephrase it like that:
Эту книгу трудно перевести.
Something like that. I hope it's of any help
I do not claim that my opinion is absolutely true.
If you've spotted any mistake in my English, please, correct it. I want to be aware of any mistakes to efficiently eliminate them before they become a habit.
It's all about variations in Russian. In Russian there can be different ways of expressing approximately the same ideas. In short, a speaker of Russian has a choice as to what to say and how to say it (such variations make the language more versatile in terms of language aesthetics and expressive ability of the language; as a natural consequence, the language becomes more complicated in terms of studying and understanding if you are a foreigner having mis/fortune to learn Russian).
So Эта книга трудна для перевода ~ This book is difficult to translate. (in Russian it's emphasized that the book itself is difficult to translate)
Эту книгу трудно переводить ~ It is difficult to translate this book. (in Russian it's emphasized that the process of translating is difficult).... seems the meaning is very close and the difference is very subtle
In English such variation is possible due to change of word order, because this is the nature of English, it's how it is organized.
On the contrary, in Russian, change of word order can be used to emphasize certain words in the whole sentence, PLUS Russian has this ability to use other parts of speech (short forms of adjectives, using verbs if deemed better).
I think in this choice of words in Russian it's all about the speaker's choice and what they want to emphasize, how they want it to sound.
- right!
- hmm...not exactly. It rather refers to the "dummy" subject which is expressed by "it" in English (It is difficult), and which is just omitted in Russian.
You can simplify the phrase to make it clearer:
Мне трудно. - It is difficult to me.
Это очень трудно. - That (something mentioned before) is very difficult.
It is the same as when you say:
Мне холодно. - It is cold to me.
Сегодня жарко. - It is hot today.
Здесь весело. - It is joyfully here (meaning that people are having lots of fun).
Скучно. - It is boring.
To be precise, they are not even adjectives. Neither they are adverbs. The words in those examples (ending with "-о") look like adverbs (or like neuter short adjectives), but according to the academic grammar they are "words of condition" here. They are used when you describe a condition which just exists, and normally no grammatical subject is needed.
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