Thread: North Korea entered 'Nuclear club'. Iran's next?

Originally Posted by Тоби

It will be like usual, the US will get blamed if they do something or if they dont.
They are already getting blamed for Korea even having the thought of a Nuclear weapon...

Weird. Are someone blaming *USA* for *North Korea* having nuclears? If somebody really doing it, they aren't adequate. Everybody knows, what USA policy was to make N. Korea as weak and defenceless, as they can.

Originally Posted by Scorpio

Originally Posted by Тоби

It will be like usual, the US will get blamed if they do something or if they dont.
They are already getting blamed for Korea even having the thought of a Nuclear weapon...

Weird. Are someone blaming *USA* for *North Korea* having nuclears? If somebody really doing it, they aren't adequate. Everybody knows, what USA policy was to make N. Korea as weak and defenceless, as they can.

They will be blamed, wait until after the sanctions get imposed.
And I dont know what policy your reading out there in Russia but I dont believe we have a policy on making N. Korea weak and defenseless.
We just dont believe they should be attacking the weaker defenseless countries, such as South Korea.

Let's see who's got the tightest ass:



In a Global Thermonuclear War nobody wins.
But maybe - just maybe - you can lose the least.


HAVE A NICE DAY

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Soviet Anti-NATO propaganda for children (1985)

http://fishki.net/comment.php?id=14404

I've never heard anything about the US being blamed for the N. Koreans having nukes. But if we are being blamed, why the heck should it be OUR fault? After all, it's the RUSSIANS who are sending them fuel. This is classic "It's all America's fault" babbling. If people can't find someone to blame problems on, they point at the US, while the remaining fingers point back at them.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

I've never heard anything about the US being blamed for the N. Koreans having nukes. But if we are being blamed, why the heck should it be OUR fault? After all, it's the RUSSIANS who are sending them fuel. This is classic "It's all America's fault" babbling. If people can't find someone to blame problems on, they point at the US, while the remaining fingers point back at them.

You're missing the point. By naming itself the only superpower left USA took all responcibility for everything that happens on the globe. This is how politics works. Read Il Principe by Niccolo Machiavelli. Nothing has changed since 16th century when he wrote it.

Please, don't be naive! That's as ridiculuous claim as the claim of the US to be "the global police". USA has never said that and never will, because it isn't their interest to be a "global police" (whatever that means). Secondly, if Ula Gulabula in Burkina Faso decides to murder his uncle Gula Bulabula because Gula Bulabula insulted him, who is at fault? The government of Burkina Faso? USA? God?

You are responible for your own actions.

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Please, don't be naive! That's as ridiculuous claim as the claim of the US to be "the global police". USA has never said that and never will, because it isn't their interest to be a "global police" (whatever that means).

Да, Калинка. Многие из нас выросли с СССР и многое, из того что сейчас делает Америка, сильно напоминает, то что делал Советский Союз во внешней политике. Мы это видели изнутри, а люди, которые не жили при советской власти, не могут сравнить методы - им кажется что США борется за правое дело и надо быть достаточно циничным что бы понять, что это все одинаково под разными личинами. На все заявления Буша в оправдание демократии на штыках, русский челове хлебнет щец, усмехнется и пропоет: "Я тебе конечно верю..."

Just because a nation is the dominant power in the world doesn't mean it is responsible for all the problems in the world. If a local politician in New Guinea gets shot, whose fault is it? The US? Of course not. And what if you guys had won the Cold War and became the dominant superpower? How would you like it if we blamed your Soviet government for everything that went wrong in the world?

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Just because a nation is the dominant power in the world doesn't mean it is responsible for all the problems in the world. If a local politician in New Guinea gets shot, whose fault is it? The US? Of course not. And what if you guys had won the Cold War and became the dominant superpower? How would you like it if we blamed your Soviet government for everything that went wrong in the world?

The core problem is: if a local policician in New Guinea gets shot - why US interferes? US has its interests in all parts of the world. It need resources and it need markets. If only it didn't solve such problems by military force nobody would blame US for trying to gain a world's domination. US will never dominate the world. That simple statement should hold firm in minds of US government members. Untill then - USA is the country to be blamed for everything.

The US doesn't interfere with its military all the time. For example, in Darfur, there's all this genocide going on and are we over there with our tanks and guns? Nope. Terrorists from Chechnya bombed a theater in Moscow. Were we over there? Nope. And not everyone agrees with our military interventions. Not everyone agrees with us in Iraq, and most people didn't agree with us in Kosovo (I sure didn't). So to blame America as a whole is unnecessary, and you can't always assume we're going to jump in with machine guns every time something goes wrong on the other side of the world.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

So to blame America as a whole is unnecessary, and you can't always assume we're going to jump in with machine guns every time something goes wrong on the other side of the world.

You know this, I know this, many people know this but many don't. You asked what makes non-US people think badly about US - I gave you the answer why. Personally, I don't think so and I'm far from being naive as kalinka_vinnie thinks.

American media create miracles every day on american public. Hypocricy and barefaced lies about government actions and false causes of multiple American military campaigns piss people off. Especially in other countries, because they don't directly communicate with Americans they can only judge on the information they receive from your media. The word democracy became a swear-word in Russia. America offers cr@p under that term and people see that.

Originally Posted by Ramil

American media create miracles every day on american public. Hypocricy and barefaced lies about government actions and false causes of multiple American military campaigns piss people off.

You're right about that. Our media is dominated by leftist politicians and they constantly lie in the media, presenting only their side of the issue and not the whole truth. It pisses me off too.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

I've never heard anything about the US being blamed for the N. Koreans having nukes. But if we are being blamed, why the heck should it be OUR fault? After all, it's the RUSSIANS who are sending them fuel. This is classic "It's all America's fault" babbling. If people can't find someone to blame problems on, they point at the US, while the remaining fingers point back at them.

Do you know that all the nuclear fuel Russia sells to other countries we take back after it used? So it (the fuel) can not be used to any other purpose than it's direct. I don't know exactly if we sell fuel to North Korea, I think they even have not atomic power plants and Iran is only have one such plant constructing in Busher. It's reactor not functioning yet, so how could Russia sell the nuclear fuel to Iran or Korea? It's all US propaganda.

Originally Posted by Basil77

Do you know that all the nuclear fuel Russia sells to other countries we take back after it used? So it (the fuel) can not be used to any other purpose than it's direct. I don't know exactly if we sell fuel to North Korea, I think they even have not atomic power plants and Iran is only have one such plant constructing in Busher. It's reactor not functioning yet, so how could Russia sell the nuclear fuel to Iran or Korea? It's all US propaganda.

Right, whenever you don't agree with something call it propaganda. And of course N. Korea has nuclear power plants, they just tested a nuclear weapon there! That's what this whole thread is about.

Right, whenever you don't agree with something call it propaganda. And of course N. Korea has nuclear power plants, they just tested a nuclear weapon there! That's what this whole thread is about.

Even IF Russia exports nuclear reactor fuel to North Korea it can't be used in making A-bomb! Every gramm of this fuel returns to the plant there it was made and after the refining it is burying in deep grave some place like Novaya Zemlya. I know this very well because there are only two plants producing such fuel in Russia - at Novosibirsk and at my native town. It's very big plant - almost half of the town works there - and since I was living here all my life I have some information on this subject, althrow I myself don't work there. The people in my town not very fond of all that used fuel that returns from other countries here and the plant must refine, but the terms of the fuel delivery contract is very strict - every gramm must return to the fuel producing plant. It's the Inernational Agency of Atomic Energy (МАГАТЭ так пишется?) rules.

RusskiSlav is correct concerning Russia selling fuel/supplies to Iran, thats why they are against any type of sanctions on Iran, because the needed money under contract with Iran.
I dont blame Russia for selling Fuel or Nuclear know how, its the fact that Iran has hidden other Nuclear power plants from the rest of the world, including Russia. Everyone knew about 2 Reactors but not the secretive other 2 that came to light a few years ago by the US. The US pulled out and has ever since been trying to understand Iran's real Nuclear stand.
Is it really for Power or for a Nuclear weapon?

If it is for power, then what is wrong with inspections?
That really the issue in simple terms.

As for North Korea I dont know if Russia is supplying fuel or not, but its what you intend to do with that fuel that makes it wrong for N. Korea.


And its already started, Iran has been the first to blame the US on N. Korea. Go Figure......

Originally Posted by Тоби

RusskiSlav is correct concerning Russia selling fuel/supplies to Iran, thats why they are against any type of sanctions on Iran, because the needed money under contract with Iran.
I dont blame Russia for selling Fuel or Nuclear know how, its the fact that Iran has hidden other Nuclear power plants from the rest of the world, including Russia. Everyone knew about 2 Reactors but not the secretive other 2 that came to light a few years ago by the US. The US pulled out and has ever since been trying to understand Iran's real Nuclear stand.
Is it really for Power or for a Nuclear weapon?

If it is for power, then what is wrong with inspections?
That really the issue in simple terms.

As for North Korea I dont know if Russia is supplying fuel or not, but its what you intend to do with that fuel that makes it wrong for N. Korea.


And its already started, Iran has been the first to blame the US on N. Korea. Go Figure......

I myselef, as, I think, every russian with a head on his shoulders, am not very happy to have radical muslim theocratic state like Iran, especially with such non-adequate leader, like Ahmadinijad, having A-bomb so close to my country borders. Iran wants to reseve nuclear weapons and it, more likely, will. As I said, I am not happy of this fact as the majority of people in the world. BUT! Russia's fuel and components deliveries to Bushere plant can't do any help in that process! It's not possible technically! I'v repeated this for RusskiSlav - she still thinks that we are helping Iran and North Korea to get nuclear bombs and missles and to prepare attack on poor US.

Originally Posted by Basil77

Originally Posted by Тоби

RusskiSlav is correct concerning Russia selling fuel/supplies to Iran, thats why they are against any type of sanctions on Iran, because the needed money under contract with Iran.
I dont blame Russia for selling Fuel or Nuclear know how, its the fact that Iran has hidden other Nuclear power plants from the rest of the world, including Russia. Everyone knew about 2 Reactors but not the secretive other 2 that came to light a few years ago by the US. The US pulled out and has ever since been trying to understand Iran's real Nuclear stand.
Is it really for Power or for a Nuclear weapon?

If it is for power, then what is wrong with inspections?
That really the issue in simple terms.

As for North Korea I dont know if Russia is supplying fuel or not, but its what you intend to do with that fuel that makes it wrong for N. Korea.


And its already started, Iran has been the first to blame the US on N. Korea. Go Figure......

I myselef, as, I think, every russian with a head on his shoulders, am not very happy to have radical muslim theocratic state like Iran, especially with such non-adequate leader, like Ahmadinijad, having A-bomb so close to my country boulders. Iran wants to reseve nuclear weapons and it, more likely, will. As I said, I am not happy of this fact as the majority of people in the world. BUT! Russia's fuel and components deliveries to Bushere plant can't do any help in that process! It's not possible technically! I'v repeated this for RusskiSlav - she still thinks that we are helping Iran and North Korea to get nuclear bombs and missles and to prepare attack on poor US.

Thank You, finally someone who understands. I dont believe the US has ever condemnd Russia for selling Fuel or Nuclear know how to Iran or North Korea because it is alright to do. Its the fact that we as the US and other countries, believe that Iran has a changed its agenda to include Nuclear weapons.

I dont care for any country who threatens other countries based on race or discrimination as Iran has done for years.
North Korea is the same way with its counterparts in South Korea and other nations close by.

I also dont believe that Russia is helping North Korea and Iran to get Nuclear weapons to attack the US. That would totally contradict the current status that the US has with Russia. I see it as we are both in good standing. Sharing space exploration is an example. Plus all the tourists between the 2 countries. You wont see Russian/Americans going to North Korea or Iran.

Your point is quite clear and and sentinent - so it's easy to understand. What I can't understand at all - why some people in the West still think that russians always have a stone in the pocket (sorry for direct translation from russian, I mean 'to have hidden evil plans').