Thread: question about use of the word 'вот'

hey everyone..

i know the general meaning of 'вот' is: here/there (it is)

but i hear russians say it alot in mid-sentence, almost like an afterthought--like saying 'um' or 'uh' or 'so' or something similar as we do in english.

can anyone shed some light on this for me?

thanks

Originally Posted by chris86

hey everyone..

i know the general meaning of 'вот' is: here/there (it is)

but i hear russians say it alot in mid-sentence, almost like an afterthought--like saying 'um' or 'uh' or 'so' or something similar as we do in english.

can anyone shed some light on this for me?

thanks

Yes, right. This word is generally used to point to something (a location, an event, an object, an idea, ...). Perhaps it's somewhat similar to German "da".
When you have nothing more to say:
Мы поедем в Москву. Вот. - We are going to Moscow. That's it.
In exclamations:
Вот это да! - Wow!
Вот, полюбуйтесь! - Just take a look at it! (in negative context)
To put accent on something:
Вот что он сказал. - That's what he said.
Вот так и надо делать. That's the right way to do it.

ok

i see that it has lots of uses. (like most...prepositions? haha, what part of speech is вот?)

but when i hear it, it's not part of a phrase like the ones you mentioned. it's completely on it's own. or it seems to be...hmm. maybe i should listen more carefully.

Also it is a a parasite (odd) word

Originally Posted by chris86

ok

i see that it has lots of uses. (like most...prepositions? haha, what part of speech is вот?)

but when i hear it, it's not part of a phrase like the ones you mentioned. it's completely on it's own. or it seems to be...hmm. maybe i should listen more carefully.

Вот is a particle. Yes, it is often misused and overused like "ну", "как бы", "в общем", "например", "короче", "типа", "это самое" etc.
For example :
Ну вот, короче, например, не работает у тебя почта или типа того. Тогда идешь типа к администратору, и в общем он тебе как бы делает чтобы все типа работало. Вот. Только это самое, короче, логин свой записать не забудь, а то как бы придется обратно за ним идти типа.

P.S.
I knew a man (a PhD and successful businessman, by the way) who almost couldn't say a sentence without inserting "как бы" a couple of times.

Originally Posted by pisces

Originally Posted by chris86

ok

i see that it has lots of uses. (like most...prepositions? haha, what part of speech is вот?)

but when i hear it, it's not part of a phrase like the ones you mentioned. it's completely on it's own. or it seems to be...hmm. maybe i should listen more carefully.

Вот is a particle. Yes, it is often misused and overused like "ну", "как бы", "в общем", "например", "короче", "типа", "это самое" etc.
For example :
Ну вот, короче, например, не работает у тебя почта или типа того. Тогда идешь типа к администратору, и в общем он тебе как бы делает чтобы все типа работало. Вот. Только это самое, короче, логин свой записать не забудь, а то как бы придется обратно за ним идти типа.

P.S.
I knew a man (a PhD and successful businessman, by the way) who almost couldn't say a sentence without inserting "как бы" a couple of times.

haha, yeah i've heard people say 'как бы' alot too *goes to look up what it means*
it seems like most russians do like to repeat phrases or words alot within a sentence. but...i'm still confused. i mean, what does it *mean* when a russian (or otherwise) says that in a sentence in the way i described? could you give an english example that closely parallels it? would it be like saying '....so yeah anyway...' or '...ok so...' in mid-sentence? that's how it feels to me when i hear it, but i'm not sure. i'm still a beginner maybe it would help if i found an example, but it's more like a you have-to-hear-it kinda thing. but you prolly already know what i mean since you seem very skilled in russian...

or you are russian?? hehe, i can't quite make out yr location there

вот. ()

Originally Posted by chris86

haha, yeah i've heard people say 'как бы' alot too *goes to look up what it means*
it seems like most russians do like to repeat phrases or words alot within a sentence. but...i'm still confused. i mean, what does it *mean* when a russian (or otherwise) says that in a sentence in the way i described? could you give an english example that closely parallels it? would it be like saying '....so yeah anyway...' or '...ok so...' in mid-sentence? that's how it feels to me when i hear it, but i'm not sure. i'm still a beginner maybe it would help if i found an example, but it's more like a you have-to-hear-it kinda thing. but you prolly already know what i mean since you seem very skilled in russian...

or you are russian?? hehe, i can't quite make out yr location there

вот. ()

What ABBYY Lingvo dictionary says:

как бы
as if, as it were, as though
это было как бы ответом it was, as it were, a reply (to), it was a kind of reply (to)

Using a lot of such words means that the person has serious problems in expressing his ideas.
Using "как бы" before something means "something like it, but perhaps not exactly it". So one starts to insert "как бы" before every word he is not sure about and then, when he gets used to it, even before words he is sure about.
Yes, I am Russian.
My location, in more detail: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dzerzhinsk%2C_Russia

i must admit, i say как бы a LOT, but im english so therefore excused i just suck up what i hear around me!

Originally Posted by Lt. Columbo

i must admit, i say как бы a LOT, but im english so therefore excused i just suck up what i hear around me!

Apparently как бы is a relatively recent addition to the list of parasite words. I first heard it used as a useless parasite somewhere in 90s I think... Now I have to admit I use it myself sometimes... Not many of us can clearly express our thoughts!

ok i get 'как бы' now. thanks

but what about вот??

Originally Posted by chris86

hey everyone..

i know the general meaning of 'вот' is: here/there (it is)

but i hear russians say it alot in mid-sentence, almost like an afterthought--like saying 'um' or 'uh' or 'so' or something similar as we do in english.

can anyone shed some light on this for me?

thanks

This illustrates the problem of foreign language dictionaries. They assume that there is some one-to-one correspondence between words in two languages. Or at least a one-to-one correspondence between the meanings of words. In any case, the dictionaries are simply wrong, wrong, wrong. 'вот' does not mean "here/there is".

It's meaning is closer to "behold" or in more modern English "see".

Imagine someone talking in English. It was on Wednesday, see, when we were going to the movies, see. We smuggled in a bottle of vodka, see, and we got blind drunk. That's why we vomited on the street, see.

That sounds almost normal, just a bit antiquated because sometime in the 50's Americans switched to using other words such as "like" and "right".

In any case, none of this translates directly from Russian to English or vice versa. You have got to live in the language. I recommend that you learn one of these oddball words or phrases each week and start to use them in your own conversation. Vot, li, chto li, nu, vobshe, na samom dele, and so on. Use www.rambler.ru to find a dozen or two examples of how real russians use these words. The meaning should come clear from the context and then you can start to use them yourself.

If you practise conversation with real russians, then they will provide good examples to imitate. But remember, the habit of using these words varies from region to region and from individual to individual. When I was in Chelyabinsk province in the south Ural, I heard "chto li" many times a day. In Moscow I once heard a Latvian girl use it as an adjective in the middle of a sentence. But my Ukrainian girlfriend almost never uses this phrase and I didn't hear it in Kiev or southern Ukraine.

I forgot to mention another very important one of these words which isn't even a word. "-to" added to the end of a noun.

"Koe chto" is another one that I heard recently.

Originally Posted by wavetossed

If you practise conversation with real russians, then they will provide good examples to imitate.

These are not good examples to imitate You should learn to speak without these extra words! You know what I mean, right, yeah...

Chris, I feel I understand what you mean...

"И я прехал к ним на дачу.. Вот.. Ну, и там были все мои друзья".
"And I came to their country house... _Well_.. You see,there were all my friends"

Just mumbling to occupy some time

Originally Posted by wavetossed

It was on Wednesday, see, when we were going to the movies, see. We smuggled in a bottle of vodka, see, and we got blind drunk. That's why we vomited on the street, see.

That sounds almost normal...

That sounds almost normal alright