View Poll Results: Do you think that learning games in a foreign language can help you learn it faster.

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  • yes, make it as fun as you can.

    13 86.67%
  • no, to truly understand a language you should first learn the grammar, then if you must learn the culture.

    2 13.33%
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Thread: Cards: if you're fluent in Russian, please help me!!!!!!!

  1. #1
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    Cards: if you're fluent in Russian, please help me!!!!!!!

    Hey Guys! I remeber when I first began to learn french in middle school that the teacher taught us some card games in french when we had extra time. I'm haveing a hard time with this Russian and thought that that is just what I need, somehting to lighten it up.

    Could anyone out there translate these for me, I'd try it myself but I know I'll end up using the wrong words or verb tenses. Please a frustrated someone who needs something to make it easier.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Do you have a/n (two, three)...

    Yes, I have a/n (two, three)...

    No, I don't have a/n (two, three)...

    Go fishing. (imperetive) [for go fish]

    The russian way of saying "that's b.s." or some other way of saying "you're full of beans"

    Jack

    Queen

    King

    Ace

    Joker

    ...of spades

    ...of hearts

    ...of diamonds

    ...of clubs

    and I think know, but I'm just going to ask to be sure, the numbers two through ten. Which set to you use. I think it's the set that goes ADEEN, DVA, TREE, CHETIRYE...and so on

    and any other card term I may have forgotten.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Please help me out guys.
    Git 'er done!

  2. #2
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    Allright

    I went through and translated these myself. I got most of it, but I still have some questions.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    What verb would you use for have? I found Bbl N M E E T E and
    R N M E l-O (sorry, still need to get the cyrrillic up and running)

    What's the verb for fishing? For "Go fishing" I found somehting, but I don't think it's right.

    I only had one definition for king in my dictionary (for Queen, Ace, Jack, and Joker there were two definitions (one for cards)) is king the same when you're speaking about a person and the card?

    I do not get prepositions. I have the words for hearts, spades, clubs, and diamonds, but I have absolutely no idea as to how to say "queen of clubs" or "Ace of hearts".

    I still am not sure as to which set of numbers to use.

    And lastly, I couldn't find (in my pocket dictionary) a way to say bullsh--, or better yet "You're lying" That would be goos to.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    Will someone out there please help me!?!? PLEASE!?!?
    Git 'er done!

  3. #3
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    1. About "have". You can say "У меня есть..." or simply and more common "У меня..." (у меня семерка, у меня дама)

    2. What does "fishing" mean? I can't understand

    3. Yes, we use the same word for a person and the card -- Король

    4. queen of clubs = дама треф or трефовая дама or дама крестей or крестовая дама (last variant is the most common but the first is more literary)
    Ace of hearts = туз червей or червовый туз
    and so on.
    My English isn't so good, зато с русским все в порядке ))
    I'll be very thankful, if you correct my mistakes.

  4. #4
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    It appears I'm the only person who voted for the second option. Bah humbug. And as for "learn culture if you must" - I thought people learned language because they were interested in the culture.

    BTW, games are an important part of culture too.

  5. #5
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    Pushkin's famous story The Queen of Spades is Пиковая дама in Russian.
    Ingenting kan stoppa mig
    In Post-Soviet Russia internet porn downloads YOU!

  6. #6
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    O.k....

    Pranki, you've been incredibly helpful, but I still have a few questions (I'm not that bright I guess)

    1. "fishing" means to go out and catch fish, it's sort of like hunting fish, what's that in Russian.

    2. I was wrong, I do not know the four suits (hearts, diamonds, clubs, and spades, I thought I did, but what you said is different from what I've found and I'm not going to argue with a Russian about Russian :P ) could you please give me an example of each suit (Jack of clubs, Queen of hearts, King of spades, and Ace of diamonds)? I would appreciate it.

    3 Do you use the numbers " dva, tree, chetirye..." for the numbers 2-10?

    4. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying that suits are adjectives (literally). But usually they are just listed as a noun after the number/rank of the card? I just want to make sure.
    =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
    Thanks again, and if anyone else has something to add...PLEASE feel free to contribute.
    Git 'er done!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pravit
    It appears I'm the only person who voted for the second option. Bah humbug. And as for "learn culture if you must" - I thought people learned language because they were interested in the culture.

    BTW, games are an important part of culture too.
    Somehow I knew it would be you who would vote No 2.
    I voted No 1 simply because of how the question was written. Faster than what? Not using them? And because learning culture was included in the No 2 option, which has no impact on the learning of the language. Culture? Who needs it?
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

  8. #8
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    For me, culture has a huge impact on learning a language. If I dislike or have no interest for the culture of a certain country there's no way I'm going to bother to learn their language.

    As for games, sure, but you will not learn anything other than specialized terminology for whichever game it is. I honestly do not say "clubs, hearts, spades" that often in English. Games used in a language-learning context almost always mean the teacher was tired of his lazy students and decided to throw something at them to kill time. At least, that's the impression I always got when they made us play "Vocabulary word bingo" in high school French class. And that was the situation I made people play games in during my horrendous stint as a German tutor.

  9. #9
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    As for the poll question...

    The poll was just a simple question...I can't believe how over analyzing you all were. Wow! Next time I'll remember to not waste time with a poll, just ask the question. Maybe I'll get more answers.
    And, just to redeem my intelligence...I was simply asking if the oral-auditory aspect of learning this language would be more affective than the nose in the books, practicing grammar from the beginning approach.
    I personally don't think that you must love the culture of a place in order to learn a language (I do love Russian and Francophone culture, don't get me wrong) but I wouldn't take an extensive class over history of Mexico and other Spanish-speaking countries if I needed to speak it for a job, or had a friend who speaks it.
    Lighten up you guys.
    Git 'er done!

  10. #10
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    The poll was just a simple question...
    If you would prefer not to hear our opinions, it would be best not to post in this forum(or any forum, for that matter). Besides, most everyone agreed with you anyway.

    I was simply asking if the oral-auditory aspect of learning this language would be more affective
    The "oral-auditory aspect" is certainly a good approach. I question, however, if games are the best way to use this approach.

    I personally don't think that you must love the culture of a place in order to learn a language
    Of course you don't, but it makes it much more enjoyable. I am speaking about my own personal views on language learning.

    I wouldn't take an extensive class over history of Mexico and other Spanish-speaking countries if I needed to speak it for a job, or had a friend who speaks it.
    Me neither. Because in this situation you never had any interest in the culture to begin with; how can you possibly create an interest by taking history classes? Perhaps I should rephrase it - there needs to be some genuine motivation to learn the language, whether it be culture, friends, etc. Of course you can learn a language without motivation. Hundreds of people are trained to be translators every day, and most of the time they don't get to pick what language they learn. But I'm just saying it will make learning this language more enjoyable. Make languages a hobby, not work.

  11. #11
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    Sorry, Pravit, that was more aimed at the other guy. I got where you were coming from. I just didn'r care much for DDT's sarcasim.
    Git 'er done!

  12. #12
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    Oh, don't mind DDT. He's off to be a houseboy on Mallorca for two tall, blonde, bisexual English and Russian women.

  13. #13
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    Re: O.k....

    Quote Originally Posted by SashaT
    1. "fishing" means to go out and catch fish, it's sort of like hunting fish, what's that in Russian.
    Рыбалка что ли?! Oh, I thought that "fishing" is a card term! In Russian "fishing" is "рыбалка" (noun). Catch fish -- ловить рыбу. Go out and catch fish -- пойти на рыбалку.

    2. I was wrong, I do not know the four suits (hearts, diamonds, clubs, and spades, I thought I did, but what you said is different from what I've found and I'm not going to argue with a Russian about Russian :P ) could you please give me an example of each suit (Jack of clubs, Queen of hearts, King of spades, and Ace of diamonds)? I would appreciate it.
    Jack of clubs -- валет треф or трефовый валет or валет крестей or крестовый валет
    Queen of hearts -- дама червей or червовая дама
    King of spades -- король пик or пиковый король
    Ace of diamonds -- туз бубей or бубновый туз
    In each case the last variant are more common.
    The names of suits are:
    clubs -- трефы or крести
    hearts -- черви
    diamonds -- буби
    spades -- пики

    3 Do you use the numbers " dva, tree, chetirye..." for the numbers 2-10?
    We use names of digits:
    2 -- двойка
    3 -- тройка
    4 -- четверка
    5 -- пятерка
    6 -- шестерка
    7 -- семерка
    8 -- восьмерка
    9 -- девятка
    10 -- десятка

    4. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying that suits are adjectives (literally). But usually they are just listed as a noun after the number/rank of the card? I just want to make sure.
    In everyday conversations in most cases we speak "червовая дама" or "пиковый король" and so on. I'm not sure, but I think that reverse order is more literary, for example "дама червей" or "король пик".
    There is particular situation for clubs. The literary variant is "трефы" but always we use "крести" in spoken language.
    My English isn't so good, зато с русским все в порядке ))
    I'll be very thankful, if you correct my mistakes.

  14. #14
    DDT
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pravit

    I personally don't think that you must love the culture of a place in order to learn a language
    Of course you don't, but it makes it much more enjoyable. I am speaking about my own personal views on language learning.
    .
    Now that I think about it you are probably right about this. I don't think I realized till just now that I am or must be interested in Russian culture. I don't think that I ever really thought about it before. I am just not interested in buildings, opera, poetry, writers and such. I am interested in the people themselves. And I think for me that, that is culture.

    PS.. Oh, and about that job. I think it fell through.
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

  15. #15
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    I am just not interested in buildings, opera, poetry, writers and such. I am interested in the people themselves. And I think for me that, that is culture.
    Same here, baby.
    PS.. Oh, and about that job. I think it fell through.
    Yeah, that's because I got it.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by pranki
    2. What does "fishing" mean? I can't understand
    Pranki,
    In the context of cards "fishing" or better stated GO FISH is a game played by kids (and some of us really strange adults) as a way to learn initially to play cards. To GO FISH means simply "No, I don't have that card in my hand, pick up one from the deck" (In go fish, if you need a card to finsih your set you ask the other players "does anybody have a ...7 of clubs, ect, and if somebody has one in their hand they HAVE to give it to you...or something like that"
    I think for the translation of this using the russian word for GO and the RUSSIAN word for FISH would suit...because the game isn't about fishing anyways.

    Has the "that's bulls*it" question been answered? Something similar to "surely you jest" "that's wrong" "this is unfair" "this is untrue" used casually as slang to a friend in jest or in anger to an advesary..
    It is Winter and Very Cold.

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    Re: O.k....

    "Fish" is also derogatory term for a naive person.

    When playing cards, Sharks are the good players and Fish are the bad players.

    When I was a kid, we would say "Go Fish" meaning "It's your turn fool".
    Of course we meant it in a humorous way.
    Какая разница, умереть богатым или бедным?

    Какой толк от богатства если ты не счастлив.

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    Thanks

    Thanks SOOO much pranki! You have no idea how much help that was. If there's anthing I can ever do for you, let me know.
    Git 'er done!

  19. #19
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    I daresay to suggest translating "Go fish" as "Теперь себе". Though I am not much into card games. What do other Russians here think?
    «И всё, что сейчас происходит внутре — тоже является частью вселенной».

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    Re: Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by SashaT
    Thanks SOOO much pranki! You have no idea how much help that was. If there's anthing I can ever do for you, let me know.
    I did it with pleasure
    My English isn't so good, зато с русским все в порядке ))
    I'll be very thankful, if you correct my mistakes.

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