Thread: Кайли Миноуг article

Originally Posted by kwatts59

Originally Posted by TATY

Originally Posted by kwatts59

Originally Posted by TATY

Having completed the course of chemotherapy for her breast cancer...

This does not sound correct. It sounds like she sat in a classroom and took lessons on how to perform chemotherapy.

No it doesn't. Mostly because what you said is highly unlikely, and secondly because the sentence also mentions she has breat cancer.

And thirdly what you said would be "a course in/on Chemotherapy".

I still think "chemotherapy treatment" sounds better.
"course of chemotheropy" does not sound natural to me.
Maybe the Russian text should not have used the word "курс".

No, we say course of chemotherapy in English:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=uk&q=%2 ... therapy%22

I rest my case.

You can say "course of chemotherapy treament". A "course of treament" is a commonly used English phrase and means what I say it means, and it is indeed the best phrase to use for the context. To you it might not sound natural, but that's just you. And obviously from this article you can say it in Russian too.

"I completed my course of antibiotics" It does not mean or imply that I studied the drugs, it means I took them.

You question me, you even suggest the author of the article is wrong!

When you write things like "On Christmas, the gazet informs, Minogue will meet in France with her friend Oliver Marinez" I don't think you should be telling me what sounds natural in English.

Maybe you are correct that "course of chemotherapy" is proper English.
But it still is not a very common phrase.

course of chemotherapy - 103,000 hits
chemotherapy treatment - 11,300,000 hits

That is a 110 fold difference!

Originally Posted by kwatts59

Maybe you are correct that "course of chemotherapy" is proper English.
But it still is not a very common phrase.

course of chemotherapy - 103,000 hits
chemotherapy treatment - 11,300,000 hits

That is a 110 fold difference!

Do you not see why your arguement is flawed?

It's about context. The two are not equal. "Chemotherapy treatment" is the treatment in general. "A course of chemotherapy treatment" is a defined amount of time it is far more specific.

"Chemotherapy treatment" can be used in more contexts than "course of chemotherapy". As I mentioned before "a course of chemotherapy treatment" also works, and is more proper.


In the context my way is most common, which is what matters.

In the context mentioned it is most suitable, which is why I used it, which is why the author of the article used it, why people on the TV and radio use it, and why you are wrong.

House - 1,000,000,000,000 hits
Big house - 1,000,000, hits

Therefore Big house is uncommon and shouldn't be used even if it is more suitable and conveys the meaning better.

Ever heard "Quality, not quantity". Since "course of chemotherapy" sounded weird to you, I expect not.

Originally Posted by TATY

You question me, you even suggest the author of the article is wrong!

If you don't even know how to properly use a comma, I don't think you should be allowed to use bold in criticism of others.

Originally Posted by TATY

Originally Posted by kwatts59

Maybe you are correct that "course of chemotherapy" is proper English.
But it still is not a very common phrase.

course of chemotherapy - 103,000 hits
chemotherapy treatment - 11,300,000 hits

That is a 110 fold difference!

Do you not see why your arguement is flawed?

It's about context. The two are not equal. "Chemotherapy treatment" is the treatment in general. "A course of chemotherapy treatment" is a defined amount of time it is far more specific.

"Chemotherapy treatment" can be used in more contexts than "course of chemotherapy". As I mentioned before "a course of chemotherapy treatment" also works, and is more proper.


In the context my way is most common, which is what matters.

In the context mentioned it is most suitable, which is why I used it, which is why the author of the article used it, why people on the TV and radio use it, and why you are wrong.

House - 1,000,000,000,000 hits
Big house - 1,000,000, hits

Therefore Big house is uncommon and shouldn't be used even if it is more suitable and conveys the meaning better.

Ever heard "Quality, not quantity". Since "course of chemotherapy" sounded weird to you, I expect not.

I asked several people and I have come to the conculsion that there is NO significant difference between "course of chemotherapy" and "chemotherapy treatment".

The phrase "course of chemotherapy" is very rare, there are only 103k hits on google. That is why it sounds unnatural to me.
To put things into perspective, the misspelled word "lisence" got 357k hits.

Your "house" vs. "big house" example is irrevelant.

Course of chemotherapy is not rare, let alone very rare!

And you are still missing the point that you can use chemotherapt treatment within my expression to give "a course of chemotherapy treatment".

And also the meaning differs.

"She has finished her chemotherapy treatment" - That's it, it is done, she won't be having anymore, no more is planned.

"She has finished her course of chemotherapy"
"She has finished her course of chemotherapy treatment" - A course of treatment does not have to be the whole thing. There could be more planned, another course.

With cancer treatment they can do it in stages:

e.g. have one course, then have a break, then have another course of therapy.

So just because someone course of chemotherapy treatment is over it doesn't mean their chemotherapy treatment as a whole is over.

Below are quotes from ENGLISH articles about Kylie:

"she had frozen her eggs before starting a course of chemotherapy."

"[He] said a course of chemotherapy usually lasted four to six months and was followed by a course of radiotherapy. " - ooh, and course of radiotherapy. From her OFFICIAL site. And kids look at that. Surely if it was some rare unusual expression they would dumb it down for the kids?

"He said the characteristic of the tumour determined the course of treatment." - still from the OFFICIAL site.

"Kylie, 37, suffered several surgery and a course of chemotherapy"

"as well as helping doctors to decide what course her treatment will take."

"Women then face a six to eight-month course of chemotherapy in three to four weekly cycles."

"Kylie was diagnosed with breast cancer in May, and has undergone a series of operations and a course of chemotherapy."

And don't go and post examples with just "chemotherapy treament" in them, because I know it is there, but in this context it doesn't sound good, it doesn't convey the meaning as effectively.

I enjoy your logic. "I ain't heard it so it's wrong".

Originally Posted by TATY

Course of chemotherapy is not rare, let alone very rare!

And you are still missing the point that you can use chemotherapt treatment within my expression to give "a course of chemotherapy treatment".

And also the meaning differs.

"She has finished her chemotherapy treatment" - That's it, it is done, she won't be having anymore, no more is planned.

"She has finished her course of chemotherapy"
"She has finished her course of chemotherapy treatment" - A course of treatment does not have to be the whole thing. There could be more planned, another course.

With cancer treatment they can do it in stages:

e.g. have one course, then have a break, then have another course of therapy.

So just because someone course of chemotherapy treatment is over it doesn't mean their chemotherapy treatment as a whole is over.

Below are quotes from ENGLISH articles about Kylie:

"she had frozen her eggs before starting a course of chemotherapy."

"[He] said a course of chemotherapy usually lasted four to six months and was followed by a course of radiotherapy. " - ooh, and course of radiotherapy. From her OFFICIAL site. And kids look at that. Surely if it was some rare unusual expression they would dumb it down for the kids?

"He said the characteristic of the tumour determined the course of treatment." - still from the OFFICIAL site.

"Kylie, 37, suffered several surgery and a course of chemotherapy"

"as well as helping doctors to decide what course her treatment will take."

"Women then face a six to eight-month course of chemotherapy in three to four weekly cycles."

"Kylie was diagnosed with breast cancer in May, and has undergone a series of operations and a course of chemotherapy."

And don't go and post examples with just "chemotherapy treament" in them, because I know it is there, but in this context it doesn't sound good, it doesn't convey the meaning as effectively.

I enjoy your logic. "I ain't heard it so it's wrong".

I substituted "course of chemotherapy" with "chemotherapy treatment"
in your examples. They are pretty much interchangeable with little
or no change in meaning.

"she had frozen her eggs before starting a course of chemotherapy."
"she had frozen her eggs before starting chemotherapy treatment."

"[He] said a course of chemotherapy usually lasted four to six months and was followed by a course of radiotherapy. "
"[He] said the chemotherapy treatment usually lasted four to six months and was followed by radiotherapy treatment. "

This sentence is gramatically incorrect.
"Kylie, 37, suffered several surgery and a course of chemotherapy"
"Kylie, 37, suffered from several surgeries and chemotherapy treatment"

"Women then face a six to eight-month course of chemotherapy in three to four weekly cycles."
"Women then face a six to eight-month chemotherapy treatment in three to four weekly cycles."

"Kylie was diagnosed with breast cancer in May, and has undergone a series of operations and a course of chemotherapy."
"Kylie was diagnosed with breast cancer in May, and has undergone a series of operations and chemotherapy treatment."

The word "course" in these examples means "choice" or "path" or "direction".
It is unfortunate but the word "course" has serveral different meanings.

"He said the characteristic of the tumour determined the course of treatment."

"as well as helping doctors to decide what course her treatment will take."

Kylie, 37, suffered from several surgeries and chemotherapy treatment

Erm

Kylie, 37, suffered several operations...

Personally I wouldn't pluralise surgery as it is a concept rather than a finite act. Of course the sentence is wrong, "several surgery" doesn't work.

You don't say "I had a surgery", you say "I had surgery".

Of course their is the other meaning of surgery as in "A doctor's surgery".... which actually in itself has two meanings....

Anyway, if you are talking about the building, of course it may be pluralised. But you shouldn't really pluralise surgery when it means "going under the knife".

"Suffering from" is different. The author isn't saying "she suffered due to", he/she is saying "she had to endure".

The only problem in that sentence was "surgery" being in the singular.

Yes you may be able to stick "chemotherapy treatment" everywhere, but the meaning is slightly different, you just can't notice it. The writers use it for a reason, and it is not rare.

Fact is, the person who wrote the Russian article used "course", the English writers used "course", I used "course", and no one else who read your translation picked up on it being unnatural.

You can't dig yourself out of this hole Mr.

F'nar.

The world is rarely black and white, but this argument is.

Tatu is right, Kwatts is wrong.

'A course of chemotherapy' is a specific, discrete cycle of treatment. 'Chemotherapy treatment' is simply a general description. Only the former can possibly be used in the context of the original article, unless it was written by an illiterate writer for illiterate readers.

Oh hold on, it was in The Sun, wasn't it?

Scotcher, will you civil partnership me? :P

Kylie had a course of chemotherapy

vs.

Kylie had chemotherapy treatment

Ok. Maybe the sentences have slightly different meaning.
But the first sentence just sounds weird to me!

The first one sounds weird to me too. Maybe it's a dialectal thing.

Thanks for your opinion Darobat

Watch out though, you might make enemies with TATY.

No, it's just that both of you don't know English properly.

Originally Posted by TATY

No, it's just that both of you of don't know English properly.

You know, this is a really silly argument!

Especially, when you burn yourself!

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by TATY

No, it's just that both you of don't know English properly.

You know, this is a really silly argument!

Especially, when you burn yourself!

Don't you think you would prefer to be placed after of instead of before of?

Originally Posted by TATY

No, it's just that both of don't know English properly.

I would say:

No. It's just that both of you don't know proper English.

But maybe TATY is just testing us.

Originally Posted by kwatts59

Thanks for your opinion Darobat

Watch out though, you might make enemies with TATY.

My Scotcher beats your Darobat.

Originally Posted by TATY

My Scotcher beats your Darobat.

I agree that scotcher appears to have great knowlege in the English language. But even the best scholars can make mistakes.

Originally Posted by scotcher

'A course of chemotherapy' is a specific, discrete cycle of treatment. 'Chemotherapy treatment' is simply a general description.

The following examples have a specific start and end.
"She had a course of chemotherapy from January to February."
"She had chemotherapy treatment from January to February."

General descritpion
"She had chemotherapy"

"She had chemotherapy from January to February."
This does not state whether it was one treatement, or serveral treatments.

You cannot say
"She had a chemotherapy" Ugh!

Originally Posted by Spiderkat

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by TATY

No, it's just that both you of don't know English properly.

You know, this is a really silly argument!

Especially, when you burn yourself!

Don't you think you would prefer to be placed after of instead of before of?

Luckily, can blame I self-irony this on!