Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: The structure "for + pro(noun) + infinitive" as the subject, is it possible?

  1. #1
    Почтенный гражданин oldboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Россия, Москва
    Posts
    311
    Rep Power
    9

    The structure "for + pro(noun) + infinitive" as the subject, is it possible?

    For example,
    For us to have been invited to the party prompts in us an inordinate pride.

    Does it equal to 'To have been invited to the party prompts in us an inordinate pride.' in meaning?
    I mean is it possible that the structure would be used as the subject or is it used like this never?
    Thanks for correcting me.

  2. #2
    zxc
    zxc is offline
    Почтенный гражданин
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    151
    Rep Power
    8
    The subject of a sentence can never be within a prepositional phrase (in a 'for' clause).

    Your tenses also don't sound natural. To invite someone to something and to prompt something are straightforward tasks and I would say they demand the perfect past tense in this context, not the present perfect progressive. Thus,
    For us to have been invited to the party prompted in us an inordinate pride.
    To have been invited to the party prompted in us an inordinate pride.

    The meaning is the same, but 'for us' is not part of the subject. I'll also comment that neither phrase sounds very natural/native. Infinitives are most often used as subjects in habitual/general circumstances (e.g. To study Russian is very difficult). So you could naturally say something like 'To be invited prompts an inordinate pride', but it doesn't sound quite right when you personalize it in the past. If you wanted to use a similar structure that sounds more natural, I would use a gerund (verbal noun), e.g.
    Being invited to the party prompted in us an inordinate pride.

  3. #3
    Почётный участник
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    туманный альбион
    Posts
    91
    Rep Power
    7
    I agree 100% with zxc. Although perfectly acceptable from a grammatical point of view, you'd be unlikely to hear this kind of sentence very often in practice. Except possibly in some kind of dispute where part of the sentence may be particularly stressed.
    eg.maybe:
    -it is an honour for us to have been invited
    -Don't be silly! you don't mean that
    -no,no, I insist . For us to have been invited is a huge honour.

    Does it equalIs it equivalent to 'To have been invited to the party prompts in us an inordinate pride.' in meaning?
    Yes, exactly, although there is also another type of for+to+infinitive clause which can't be so easily separated and which does fit well as the subject of the sentence

    eg.
    For 13 of our students to have been selected is a truly outstanding achievement.

    For Boustany to have been found in breach of care by two Panels is pretty extraordinary under the circumstances.

    Here the for + to is more like an infinitive-based that-clause. In fact it means pretty much the same thing as "that + should". ie. in the above sentences "For 13 of our students to have been selected..." and "For Boustany to have been found..." are close in meaning to "That 13 of our students should have been selected..." and "That Boustany should have been found...".

  4. #4
    Почтенный гражданин oldboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Россия, Москва
    Posts
    311
    Rep Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by zxc View Post
    The subject of a sentence can never be within a prepositional phrase (in a 'for' clause).
    Many thanks, zxc.
    Thanks for correcting me.

  5. #5
    Почтенный гражданин oldboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Россия, Москва
    Posts
    311
    Rep Power
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by Paperplane View Post
    Here the for + to is more like an infinitive-based that-clause. In fact it means pretty much the same thing as "that + should". ie. in the above sentences "For 13 of our students to have been selected..." and "For Boustany to have been found..." are close in meaning to "That 13 of our students should have been selected..." and "That Boustany should have been found...".
    Paperplane, in "That 13 of our students should have been selected..." and "That Boustany should have been found...", is should used to express the importance of an action? For example like here:
    It's important that somebody should talk to the police.
    Is it necessary that my uncle should be informed?
    Thanks for correcting me.

  6. #6
    Почётный участник
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    туманный альбион
    Posts
    91
    Rep Power
    7
    Yes, exactly. In English should is sometimes used as a kind of pseudo-subjunctive(like in the examples you have given there). And so in the sentence "That Boustany should have been found..." 'should' conveys some kind of subjective attitude to what has occured. In this case perhaps among other things surprise.

  7. #7
    Почтенный гражданин oldboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Россия, Москва
    Posts
    311
    Rep Power
    9
    I see. Thanks a lot, Paperplane.
    Thanks for correcting me.

Similar Threads

  1. "c" for "д" in Infinitive?
    By radomir in forum Grammar and Vocabulary
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: August 20th, 2010, 03:27 PM
  2. English-German --> Lesson "Noun Gender and Number"
    By MasterAdmin in forum Translate This!
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: January 5th, 2010, 01:57 AM
  3. How to say "Bless our home" and "Happy Holidays" in Russian?
    By Ruby Daniels in forum How do you Say... in Russian?
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: December 19th, 2009, 03:29 PM
  4. "can i have [noun]"?
    By zomby_pengy in forum Translate This!
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: June 16th, 2006, 05:26 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Russian Lessons                           

Russian Tests and Quizzes            

Russian Vocabulary