Thread: English and American langs

Spelling is just spelling. It doesn't affect a language's grammar and (in English) it rarely even affects pronunciation. As evidence of Australian English moving closer to American English: Australian newspapers almost never use the strange English combination of singular noun and plural verb ("Manchester United are...").

Originally Posted by Jeff

Spelling is just spelling. It doesn't affect a language's grammar and (in English) it rarely even affects pronunciation. As evidence of Australian English moving closer to American English: Australian newspapers almost never use the strange English combination of singular noun and plural verb ("Manchester United are...").

But they use Police ARE..., The United States ARE..., etc, if this is waht you mean. Of course, there is American influence in Australia - thanks to movies and internet but as I said it's more British than American, especially pronunciation, vocab and grammar. They say truck, not lorry (not sure if "lorry" is still used in UK), but boot, not trunk.

But aren't you just making an assumption that the word "truck" is an "American" word in the first place? or "trunk" for that matter?

What proof is there that Aussie english is even 'drifting"? Even in the early 1960's most people used the word "truck" in Australia.
I submit to you that all these words are of English origin.

Originally Posted by DDT

But aren't you just making an assumption that the word "truck" is an "American" word in the first place? or "trunk" for that matter?

What proof is there that Aussie english is even 'drifting"? Even in the early 1960's most people used the word "truck" in Australia.
I submit to you that all these words are of English origin.

No, the word "truck" doesn't prove anything about the drift - all I know that dictionaries show lorry as B.E. and truck is A.E. (used in the same meaning of a lorry, not a handcart). "Boot" (A.E.) is more common than "trunk" (B.E.). Everyone knows what diapers (A.E.) are but Australians just say nappies (B.E.).

I can see the drift in kids, they use more American words than adults. It's more likely American English will take over in Australia, especially the vocabulary.

English is not my first language, so I don't have the full picture of trends and differences. Australian English is closer to B.E. because English-speaking are descendents from England, many of them are just second generation Australians and they make the largest proportion of immigrants followed by New Zealanders.

TV is dominated by Hollywood, of course except for ABC channel, which shows British movies and series non-stop.

Back to the original question: In my opinion, as a non-native speaker, which version of English to learn is not important, it's not like choice between Mandarin or Cantonese. Variants of English are not separate languages. Even if you choose a version, what you read and who you talk to will influence your English.

Originally Posted by DDT

But aren't you just making an assumption that the word "truck" is an "American" word in the first place? or "trunk" for that matter?

What proof is there that Aussie english is even 'drifting"? Even in the early 1960's most people used the word "truck" in Australia.
I submit to you that all these words are of English origin.

'Truck,' describing a road vehicle for freight, has its origin in America—even the obscenely Anglocentric Shorter Oxford English Dictionary concedes this fact. The Australians borrowed the word in that meaning from the Americans.

FYI
http://esl.about.com/library/vocabulary/blbritam.htm

Milanya, thank you for the link. I would suggest a few revisions to its author (and to any curious learners who may follow the link):

An optometrist is an oculist, not an occultist (misspelled as "oculltist").

Anyplace, someplace etc. are colloquial and should not be used in careful speech and writing.

Rubber for 'condom' is most definitely an impolite usage—it should be classified as a mild obscenity.

Angry is also used in the USA beside mad—they are synonyms in that sense. Indeed, angry is, in my opinion, the more common word.

There may be other mistakes but I didn't go through the whole list.

Originally Posted by Jeff

Angry is also used in the USA beside mad—they are synonyms in that sense. Indeed, angry is, in my opinion, the more common word.

I don't hear the word angry near as often as I hear mad, but that is just me.

Originally Posted by Joel

Originally Posted by Jeff

Angry is also used in the USA beside mad—they are synonyms in that sense. Indeed, angry is, in my opinion, the more common word.

I don't hear the word angry near as often as I hear mad, but that is just me.

Same with me - when I watch American movies. In Australia "mad" means crazy. It's always funny to hear in movies people saying "Don't be mad", "Are you mad?", when they mean angry.

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On American/British English used in Australia. Everybody says and writes 'autumn', not 'fall' here.

Originally Posted by Анатолий

On American/British English used in Australia. Everybody says and writes 'autumn', not 'fall' here.

I haven't heard anyone say the word autumn for years

Originally Posted by Joel

Originally Posted by Анатолий

On American/British English used in Australia. Everybody says and writes 'autumn', not 'fall' here.

I haven't heard anyone say the word autumn for years

Ask me!

AS it turns out, you are quite right about the word "truck". I talked with an 80 year old Australian who remembers only hearing the word "lorry" for truck, in her childhood.

Originally Posted by Rtyom

Originally Posted by Joel

Originally Posted by Анатолий

On American/British English used in Australia. Everybody says and writes 'autumn', not 'fall' here.

I haven't heard anyone say the word autumn for years

Ask me!

I use "autumn" and "fall" equally, they are synonyms. I actually prefer using the word "autumn" because "fall" is ambiguous. People confuse it with the verb "to fall".

Originally Posted by Joel

Originally Posted by Анатолий

On American/British English used in Australia. Everybody says and writes 'autumn', not 'fall' here.

I haven't heard anyone say the word autumn for years

Check MY location, I am talking about English in AUSTRALIA, not US. My post was in answer to the question, which English is spoken in Australia, American or British.

[quote=Анатолий]

Originally Posted by Joel

Originally Posted by "Анатолий":2gslpx3w

On American/British English used in Australia. Everybody says and writes 'autumn', not 'fall' here.

I haven't heard anyone say the word autumn for years

Check MY location, I am talking about English in AUSTRALIA, not US. My post was in answer to the question, which English is spoken in Australia, American or British.[/quote:2gslpx3w]I wasn't argueing with you. I was just stating that I haven't heard anyone use the word autumn in a long time.

And are there areas where people don't follow the influence and just prefer to use either "autumn" or "fall" just because of their sound (a case as with kwatts)?

Originally Posted by Rtyom

And are there areas where people don't follow the influence and just prefer to use either "autumn" or "fall" just because of their sound (a case as with kwatts)?

No, I don't think so. As I said it's more British than American English in Australia (but there are things specific to only Australian English) because of their origin - Australians came from UK, not from US, some American influence doesn't change people's speech dramatically, some are even hostile to any influence and laugh imitating US accents and vocab (as some in America would laugh at British or Australian way of speaking).

Fall is the commoner word here in the USA, but autumn is heard as well. (Tv weathermen/-women in particular seem to prefer it.) But autumn is not common as a modifier: One is much more likely to hear fall semester than autumn semester.

Umm.. this may only be an accepted rule of thumb for my area of the good old red-white-and-blue.. but if we hear someone speaking with a british accent, and they say things that we don't really understand. we just (mentally) shrug out shoulders and chalk it up as "those english and their language*. If you try and pick up a british accent, then travel to america.. then you may be given more leeway (room for making errors), as noone really knows what the english are talking about half the time. I know, I listened to an english shop owner in my area, and pretty much just listened to her accent and nodded a lot. ^^;;
........

In all seriousness, there will be words which do not translate very well, in either how they are used in a sentence, how they are pronounced, or.. OH, something important. If you understand the word, and are comfortable with saying it's translated counterpart.. then also associate that word with a facial expression if it is a very serious topic or a very relaxed topic. So when you are talking about a serious matter with someone, use a serious facial expression. But when you are speaking about something everyday or something funny.. use a relaxed facial expression. Even when we don't understand the words, understanding someone's facial expression helps to fill in the gaps.. some.

I'm English. Although I get annoyed often with other English people using American spellings or words, I don't think anyone would think badly of a foreigner using American English. Even a mix of the two will not get you laughed at (maybe misunderstood though if you start talking about jam/jelly/jello or chips/fries/crisps in the wrong way.) If you come to English you will probably be surprised at how bad most people are at speaking proper English.

There are probably more reasons for choosing American English. It's more widely spoken, and for business you are probably (I may be wrong) more likely to meet Americans. You're probably, unless you have an interest in England, more likely to visit America, and watch American TV shows and read American books. The only reasons for choosing to speak English English is the fact that we are in the same continent and English is the original. Once you've learned the differences, it will be easy for you to switch between when you need to. I could easily write American English if I needed to, although I'd probably forget sometimes.