Thread: pronunciation of o

So when is o pronounced as a?

For example: золото, около, кокаин, отходить, полтара, полгода, чувствовать.

Originally Posted by paasikivi

So when is o pronounced as a?

For example: золото, около, кокаин, отходить, полтора, полгода, чувствовать.

Unstressed "o" is not actually pronounced like "a".
It's a cross between "a" and "э" and "ы".
So this sound is pronounced when "o" is not stressed and the next syllable is not stressed too. For example:
з́олото, ́около, кока́ин, полтор́а, ч́увствовать.

But if the next syllable is stressed then "o" is pronounced nearly like "a" (one can pronounce "a"). For example:
вод́а, ход́ить, нос́ок, полтор́а etc


"Полгода" is a composite word: "пол" (половина, half) + "год", so two "o" are pronounced like "o", but the last "o" is stressed.

Originally Posted by Оля

Unstressed "o" is not actually pronounced like "a".
It's a cross between "a" and "э" and "ы".

I suppose spoken language was before writing. So who got the idea to write "o" in place of this letter?

Originally Posted by Оля

Unstressed "o" is not actually pronounced like "a".
It's a cross between "a" and "э" and "ы".
So this sound is pronounced when "o" is not stressed and the next syllable is not stressed too. For example:
[b][color=darkred]з́олото

But for example "золото здесь",

the first o would be o, the second is the mixture of "a" and "э" and "ы" and because здесь is stressed, the last o must be actually "a"?

Originally Posted by paasikivi

I suppose spoken language was before writing. So who got the idea to write "o" in place of this letter?

Well, every language was only spoken first
But to pronounce 'a' in unstressed syllables is a particular Moscovite accent. In some regions they pronounce 'o' everywhere.

Originally Posted by Оля

"Полгода" is a composite word: "пол" (половина, half) + "год", so two "o" are pronounced like "o", but the last "o" is stressed.

I am pronouncing the first O here just like the 2nd one in "poltora".

Originally Posted by paasikivi

Originally Posted by Оля

Unstressed "o" is not actually pronounced like "a".
It's a cross between "a" and "э" and "ы".
So this sound is pronounced when "o" is not stressed and the next syllable is not stressed too. For example:
[b][color=darkred]з́олото

But for example "золото здесь",

the first o would be o, the second is the mixture of "a" and "э" and "ы" and because здесь is stressed, the last o must be actually "a"?

I don't think this carries across word boundaries.

Originally Posted by paasikivi

But for example "золото здесь",

the first o would be o, the second is the mixture of "a" and "э" and "ы" and because здесь is stressed, the last o must be actually "a"?

The mixture of "a" and "э" and "ы" is called "ер" [йэр].
The faint "a" is called "крышка" (Λ)

The last o ("золото здесь") must be "ер", not "крышка".

Originally Posted by Оля

Originally Posted by paasikivi

But for example "золото здесь",

the first o would be o, the second is the mixture of "a" and "э" and "ы" and because здесь is stressed, the last o must be actually "a"?

The mixture of "a" and "э" and "ы" is called "ер" [йэр]

aka schwa.

Originally Posted by Оля

So this sound is pronounced when "o" is not stressed and the next syllable is not stressed too.
But if the next syllable is stressed then "o" is pronounced nearly like "a".

These rules work inside one word, not inside all the sentence.

Originally Posted by paasikivi

I suppose spoken language was before writing. So who got the idea to write "o" in place of this letter?

We say "стол", but "стола" (o in "стола" is крышка). Do you offer to write it "стала"??? (btw "стала" is the form of a verb)

And who got the idea to write "hawk" if it's pronounced [hok]???
Who devised the words "right" & "write"?

Olya you've just confused the poor person.

The sound Olya is trying to describe is called a Schwa, which is the sound the a in the English Sofa has.

Sofa
Banana
Circus


It's an ultra-short vowel sound.

Schwa gets its name from the Hebrew "Sheva", which is a vowel sound represented by a :

The word Sheva in Hebrew means "nought" or "zero".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwa

The IPA symbol is an upside down E.

Originally Posted by paasikivi

Originally Posted by Оля

Unstressed "o" is not actually pronounced like "a".
It's a cross between "a" and "э" and "ы".

I suppose spoken language was before writing. So who got the idea to write "o" in place of this letter?

That's a really stupid question.
But anyway:

O used to be pronounced O all the time, it was much later that people in Russia started reducing unstressed O to A or Schwa.

Вод

Originally Posted by TATY

Olya you've just confused the poor person.

Oh really?

Originally Posted by Оля

Originally Posted by TATY

Olya you've just confused the poor person.

Oh really?

Yes. He can hardly grasp the simple concept of O reduction, and you go saying the sound is a cross between A and Э and Ы. The guy can probably not even pronounced Ы yet :P

I think paasikivi will grasp on his own.
I just replied to the question. If the answer is complicated then you offer do not reply?

Originally Posted by Оля

And who got the idea to write "hawk" if it's pronounced [hok]???
Who devised the words "right" & "write"?

That's some other stupid person.

Originally Posted by TATU

The sound Olya is trying to describe is called a Schwa, which is the sound the a in the English Sofa has.

So are you saying that Schwa = йер ? So that for example it would be present in "много"? This is clearly pronounced многa.

Originally Posted by paasikivi

So are you saying that Schwa = йер ?

Yes.

Originally Posted by paasikivi

So that for example it would be present in "много"? This is clearly pronounced многa.

No.
Not clearly.

TATY, talk about confusing people. You wrote above that there is a second syllable in "played" that is pronounced schwa?

Originally Posted by Оля

Originally Posted by paasikivi

So that for example it would be present in "много"? This is clearly pronounced многa.

No.
Not clearly.

That's the way I hear it anyway.