Thread: Is Belarus next??

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by laxxy

PS. I personally hate commies

Me too

Why don't you bomb them?

Yep, blame everything on commies... And on bicyclists...

I never really understood the argument that Putin was "KGB". Who cares?

And no, he was not a 'Colonel'.

Putin started out his career working in Leningrad (His home town) keeping tabs on foriegners. What was described as a pretty bottom of the barrell job. As far as anyone knows the only time he even ever went overseas was to do some office work in East Germany.

Putin tried to resign from the KGB 3 times, the first two times he was just kept on their payroll... without even conducting any operations offiliated with the agency, while he worked with a friend who was a professor at a Leningrad university. In 1991 he was OFFICIALLY released from the agency, but hadn't actually worked for them for some time. I believe the best rating he ever recieved from superiors while serving in the KGB was "satisfactory".

He worked for the KGB, He was a patriotic soviet who wanted to serve his country, So sue him. Why dont you go sue all the WWII veterans from the eastern fron for being commies for that matter. Why dont we just sue everybody in the FBI too? Damn capitalists!

Im also pretty sick and tired of hearing people complain about Uzbekistan. Its all the kids do in the Uzbek class here at the DLI. The presdient of uzbekistan has been an allie of GW giving him bases and crap, from which to blow away taliban in afghanistan. The whole reason he is seen as "oppressive" is because he as all but outlawed the ismalic religion in his country. And for good reason. He shares a border with freaking afghanistan, HELLO!

He jails people who are suspected of being islamic terrorists in order to keep militant groups from setting training camps up in his country and as to not provide a safe haven for fleeing taliban into his country. Aww hes locking up extremists... poor guys! Guess what! SO DOES AMERICA.

Tired of the hipocracy.

Originally Posted by SSSS

Yep, blame everything on commies... And on bicyclists...

You shouldn't put all bicyclists onto the same basket. Not all bicyclists are equal, you know!

Acctually, sometimes I just want put all the bicyclist next to the wall and shoot every second one in the back of their head...

Originally Posted by SSSS

Acctually, sometimes I just want put all the bicyclist next to the wall and shoot every second one in the back of their head...

Yes, that's what those sneaky bicyclists deserve.
They are all probably commies anyway, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if they had secretly conducted military style parades at night, when everyone is sleeping. That is why they are riding bicycles, it's so that no one hears them coming!

MINSK - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has praised Belarus, calling it "a model social state like the one we are beginning to create".
During a visit to Minsk, he called for a strategic alliance with Belarus to counter "hegemonic" capitalism.
Here's the BBC story:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5209868.stm

Great... Chavez wants to bring back back dictatorship to South America, a drug-lord that deals oil instead of cocaine. And he wants to buy toys:

MOSCOW - Russia has struck a deal worth more than $1 billion to supply fighter jets and helicopters to Venezuela, Russian Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov said on Friday.

MSNBC story :
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/13972383/

I reckon Chavez is doing a great job in improving living conditions, but anyway.... just my opinion.

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by laxxy

PS. I personally hate commies

Me too

Why can't you qualify your statement? Why do you hate commies?

WHY do I hate commies?! Helloooo? Look what they did to Russia in 1917! In the years that followed, the Soviet government killed anyone who disagreed with them and/or spewed propaganda to the public who had to wiat in bread lines for hours a day just to get a basic meal! Commies lie--they claim "everyone is equal" when in reality someone (the commies) are in power and have control over everything. And they abuse that control and make life miserable for everyone else. Marx believed in some ideal utopian (which in Greek appropriately means "no place") society that is impossible to ever have, because human beings are not perfect, thus there cannot be a perfect society.

Originally Posted by adoc

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by laxxy

PS. I personally hate commies

Me too

Why don't you bomb them?

Well, first of all, I don't have any bombs. And if I did, I would not bomb them because I don't operate like a communist by killing everyone who disagrees with me.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by laxxy

PS. I personally hate commies

Me too

Why can't you qualify your statement? Why do you hate commies?

WHY do I hate commies?! Helloooo? Look what they did to Russia in 1917!

And what they did? Turned the poor and ruined by WWI country into the prosperous superpower?

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

In the years that followed, the Soviet government killed anyone who disagreed with them

Please, stop this nonsence. Thousands of so called dissidents, who were disagreeing with "Soviet government", are alive and well.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

and/or spewed propaganda to the public who had to wiat in bread lines for hours a day just to get a basic meal!

Oh, yes. "Spewing propaganda..." I see.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Commies lie--they claim "everyone is equal" when in reality someone (the commies) are in power and have control over everything.

So does any so called democratic government.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

And they abuse that control and make life miserable for everyone else.

Do you know, how many people are nostalgic about this "miserable" life?

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Marx believed in some ideal utopian (which in Greek appropriately means "no place") society that is impossible to ever have, because human beings are not perfect, thus there cannot be a perfect society.

Absolutely perfect society is, of course, impossible -- but it is possible to build society good enough for people to live in.

Originally Posted by Scorpio

Absolutely perfect society is, of course, impossible -- but it is possible to build society good enough for people to live in.

It sure is. You just have to get rid of the commies first

Originally Posted by Scorpio

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Originally Posted by laxxy

PS. I personally hate commies

Me too

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

In the years that followed, the Soviet government killed anyone who disagreed with them

Please, stop this nonsence. Thousands of so called dissidents, who were disagreeing with "Soviet government", are alive and well.

Because they were able to survive the gulag, yeah. But 20 million are dead.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Commies lie--they claim "everyone is equal" when in reality someone (the commies) are in power and have control over everything.

[quote:2b89e6qg]So does any so called democratic government.

Uh, no. In any democratic government, everyone is equal UNDER THE LAW. According to communism everyone is supposed to be equal in every possible way, i.e. no one has more money than anyone else. You have to work for what you earn, and some people work harder than others. We're not all equal.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

And they abuse that control and make life miserable for everyone else.

[quote:2b89e6qg]Do you know, how many people are nostalgic about this "miserable" life?

Do you know how many people are not?

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Marx believed in some ideal utopian (which in Greek appropriately means "no place") society that is impossible to ever have, because human beings are not perfect, thus there cannot be a perfect society.

[quote:2b89e6qg]Absolutely perfect society is, of course, impossible -- but it is possible to build society good enough for people to live in.

[/quote:2b89e6qg][/quote:2b89e6qg][/quote:2b89e6qg]

Well, communism sure failed at that.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Because they were able to survive the gulag, yeah. But 20 million are dead.

Gulag as such never existed after Stalin's death. Would you mind calling things as they really are? Second, during 1921-1953 years total number of sentenced by 'political articles' was 3.8 million. Let me note, by the way, that together with 'fake' spys, traitors, terrorists, etc., there were more than enough real ones. So, your figure of 20 million 'innocent victims' is quite unrealistic.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Do you know how many people are not?

If we count as 'nostalgic' partly-nostalgic people, who doesn't want old times back, but likes certain elements of soviet past, then answer to your question is "almost nobody".

Originally Posted by Alex_Ivanov

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Because they were able to survive the gulag, yeah. But 20 million are dead.

Gulag as such never existed after Stalin's death. Would you mind calling things as they really are? Second, during 1921-1953 years total number of sentenced by 'political articles' was 3.8 million. Let me note, by the way, that together with 'fake' spys, traitors, terrorists, etc., there were more than enough real ones. So, your figure of 20 million 'innocent victims' is quite unrealistic.

Yes, I KNOW the gulag didn't exist after Stalin died, but when he was alive he killed about 20 million. Look it up in any history textbook or anywhere online and you'll see that it's greater than 3.8 million. This is copied and pasted from Wikipedia:
Some sources place the number at about 20 million, which includes approximately 5 million kulaks and other peasants killed between 1929 and 1933; 5 million who died during the Ukrainian Holodomor, 5 million executed between 1933 and 1953 (including military personnel executions during the Great Patriotic War), and 5 million dead in gulag camps. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Purge <--don't believe me? Go see for yourself. It's under the section called "Victim toll".

[quote:3meaw53t]If we count as 'nostalgic' partly-nostalgic people, who doesn't want old times back, but likes certain elements of soviet past, then answer to your question is "almost nobody".

[/quote:3meaw53t]

Well then no wonder the Russians elected a former KGB colonel for their "president".

Originally Posted by laxxy

Originally Posted by Scorpio

Absolutely perfect society is, of course, impossible -- but it is possible to build society good enough for people to live in.

It sure is. You just have to get rid of the commies first

LOL! I agree, laxxy

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Yes, I KNOW the gulag didn't exist after Stalin died, but when he was alive he killed about 20 million. Look it up in any history textbook or anywhere online and you'll see that it's greater than 3.8 million. This is copied and pasted from Wikipedia:

You call me to read some history and cite Wikipedia, that's hardly most reliable source itself. And I like that phrase: "Some sources place the number at about 20 million". What sources exactly? And where did that sources take their information from? No answer. My source is reseach of V.N.Zemskov, based on documents from Central Archive of USSR, not on any estimations taken from the sky.

History of exagerration of those number started with Khrushev. Documents from archive point out, that he perfectly knew real number of all prisoners in camps and colonies in 1953, year of Stalin's death - 2 468 524 people, including pure criminals. But he, having his own agenda, said there were 10 million people in 1953 in camps only. That started some kind of race, under slogan "who more?". I saw figures of 50 million and higher, but they all are based on nothing, but imagination. And your figure of 20million is of the same imaginary kind.

The figure stays - 3.8 million political prisoners during 33 years, including those who deserved the penalty, and about million executed.

Well then no wonder the Russians elected a former KGB colonel for their "president".

I don't understand, what's wrong with beign KGB colonel? Americans had president (G.Bush Sr.) who was head of CIA, so what? Why don't you complain?

[quote="Alex_Ivanov]

History of exagerration of those number started with Khrushev.

Well, for someone who seems to know so much one would think you could spell KhrushCHev's name right. Geez, I'm not even Russian and I know that. And whether it was 3.8 million or not, the point is Stalin killed people in mass numbers. Normal leaders don't do things like that, and anyone who is "nostalgic" for Soviet times is twisted in the mind. They're nostalgic for the days of bread lines, no free press, government control over EVERYTHING, gulags, and mass murder? Okaaayyy....(sarcasm)

Well then no wonder the Russians elected a former KGB colonel for their "president".

I don't understand, what's wrong with beign KGB colonel? Americans had president (G.Bush Sr.) who was head of CIA, so what? Why don't you complain?

The CIA is not a secret police in the same way the KGB is. The KGB knocked on peoples' doors at midnight and took them away to the gulag.

Originally Posted by RusskiSlav

Well, for someone who seems to know so much one would think you could spell KhrushCHev's name right.

Well, I know perfectly how to spell his name in cyrillic. Everything else is a question of transliteration, and I see no problem here even if I transliterated it wrong (anyway, are there some official rules? Sometimes it's funny to see how Russian names are transliterated by foreigners.)

And whether it was 3.8 million or not, the point is Stalin killed people in mass numbers. Normal leaders don't do things like that,

3.8 million political prisoners, less than million executed, minus those who was executed not because of ideology, but for real crimes like treason, espionage, terrorism, let's say 600 thousand for ideological reasons.Indeed, it's a large number by any means.

From the other side, Stalin completed too important tasks:
1. He cleared Russia from bolshevik scum that took over our country after 1917 and nearly destroyed it, sacrificing it for the sake of mythical "world revolution".
2. He turned Russia from nothing into industrial giant in less than 10 years. If he hadn't done that, we would have ceased to exist as nation.

For such global tasks, I consider number of victims acceptable, though I understand it sounds cynic.

and anyone who is "nostalgic" for Soviet times is twisted in the mind. They're nostalgic for the days of bread lines, no free press, government control over EVERYTHING, gulags, and mass murder? Okaaayyy....(sarcasm)

Are they really twisted in mind? They're nostalgic for free&good education, healthcare, feeling safe and sure. That's why I call them 'partly nostalgic'. You try to draw black&white picture, where USSR is just big black stain. Wake up, there were a lot of wonderful things there. BTW, I don't remember standing in lines for bread, minimum of life-important goods was accessible even during worst days of USSR.

The CIA is not a secret police in the same way the KGB is. The KGB knocked on peoples' doors at midnight and took them away to the gulag.

CIA is intelligence service just like KGB/FSB. Read less scary tales before falling asleep, or one day you'll wake up at midnight in death-damp - someone's steps in corridor will seem like if they come to take you to the gulag.

He turned Russia from nothing into industrial giant in less than 10 years. If he hadn't done that, we would have ceased to exist as nation

Good. The world would've been a lot better off if the Soviet Union hadn't existed. It was the Soviets who invaded Finland in 1939 and took away half their land, invaded Czechoslovakia and Hungary and destroyed their property (and took more lives) to crush anti-communism revolts, and planted nuclear missiles 90 miles off the coast of Florida and scared the crap outta the Americans by threatening to turn the Cold War nuclear.

And education in the Soviet Union was not really "good". The schools taught students only what the government wanted them to know, that is, how great communism was. And just because you don't remember standing in bread lines doesn't mean other people don't. You're Russian, I'm sure you know of Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn--read The Gulag Archipelago and perhaps you'll have different opinions about the USSR.