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Thread: Many Things

  1. #1
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    Many Things

    I have a number of things that I am needing assistance...

    First, "many things" -- много сего

    The word "thing" in the dictionary is "вещь", so I cannot fathom how they come up with "сего" in this phrase. Any explanations?

    Also, in my lessons I continually hear спросите, скажете (or is it "скажите"), and then there is also something that sounds like "от vicheyava". I cannot begin to find this in the dictionary, and do not know what it means. Also, the phrase "по провете спросите/скажете" -- I cannot understand what word the "провете" might be. Is it a perfective something??

  2. #2
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    Re: Many Things

    many things = много всего(literally "a lot of everything")
    спросите -ask(second person plural)
    спросите -ask(second person plural, imperative)
    скажете- say, tell (second person plural)
    скажите- say, tell (second person plural, imperative)

    от vicheyava
    it's отвечать(infinive form)= to answer
    по провете
    maybe it's проверите(check)
    "Happy new year, happy new year
    May we all have a vision now and then
    Of a world where every neighbour is a friend"

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    Moderator Lampada's Avatar
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    проверить
    проверьте
    проверь
    проверка
    "...Важно, чтобы форум оставался местом, объединяющим людей, для которых интересны русский язык и культура. ..." - MasterАdmin (из переписки)



  4. #4
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    Re: Many Things

    Another idea is that "по провете" could be "повторите" (repeat)
    "Happy new year, happy new year
    May we all have a vision now and then
    Of a world where every neighbour is a friend"

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    А я угадаю это слово с трех нот ..... (non translateable folklore)
    Поправите\Поправить

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    Re: Many Things

    Quote Originally Posted by Friendy
    Another idea is that "по провете" could be "повторите" (repeat)
    That is exactly what the speaker is saying.
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

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    Friendly,... thank you for your detailed response. I was not focused sharply enough on the accents or emphasis within the words, thus did not realize the distinction between скажете and скажите. I should focus more on diction.

    Your response promted me to read up in the Penguin Russian by Brown on the Imperative case or instance. It has me more confused than before -- why doesn't imperative mean imperative (i.e. the boy who cried "wolf", or the theatre cry of "fire")?! How do you know to use imperative if it isn't an imperative moment? Mere instructions or explanations are Imperative??

    The phrase "по провете спросите/скажете" is "try to ask / say" I appreciate all the kind efforts to guess what word I was trying to refer to...

    now, what is the correct cyrillic spelling of "try to"??

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    The phrase "по провете спросите/скажете" is "try to ask / say" I appreciate all the kind efforts to guess what word I was trying to refer to...
    "по провете" could actually be "попробуйте", if that's the case.

    Your response promted me to read up in the Penguin Russian by Brown on the Imperative case or instance. It has me more confused than before -- why doesn't imperative mean imperative (i.e. the boy who cried "wolf", or the theatre cry of "fire")?! How do you know to use imperative if it isn't an imperative moment? Mere instructions or explanations are Imperative??
    Imperative does mean imperative. It means the command form of the verb, in English or in Russian.

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    The speaker prompts you to "repeat" and at other times "to try" . If it is unclear to you then perhaps you should try different EQ settings on your stereo or a different system altogether. The speaker tells you what those words mean. You must have missed it. You can either review the CDs or just keep going, eventually you will get it figured out anyway.
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

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    Pravit, Brown writes in the Penguin course that the imperative forms can also be translated to English as a polite request -- "would you... or could you...". That is what I find difficult to chew, as that is so similar to the conditional "бы" constructions that we were discussing a few months ago.

    "to repeat" is повторить...I understand that. My dictionary lists пробовать / попробовать as the spellings for the word "to try" when speaking of trying to taste something. Yet, I am certain that this second spelling is what I am hearing on my tapes when I am instructed to "try to say / ask". However, the dictionary gives me постараться as the correct word for "to try/attempt". From the dictionary, "постараться" should be the correct word usage for the context of these instructions -- No? That is what is leaving me with some lack of confidence in the audio lesson.

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    My dictionary has я попробую as "I will try" perfective.
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

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    I think I am hearing the imperative form, not a perfective form of the verb.

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    Делать и сделать - несов. и соверш. вид глагола
    Я попробую отвечает на вопрос Что я сделаю?. Значит соверш.
    Я пробую отвечает на вопрос Что я делаю?. Значит здесь несоверш.
    (Не знаю поможет ли это правило не носителю языка.)

    Стараться - to try to do one's best.
    "...Важно, чтобы форум оставался местом, объединяющим людей, для которых интересны русский язык и культура. ..." - MasterАdmin (из переписки)



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    What I hear may indeed be a "you" sound ( or "yah" sound) to the end of "try" - ую... But, I swear it seem like there is a "bat" sound which precedes any "oo" sound, thus попробать sticks in my mind. Or more like попроботаю... After years of music education, I don't think my ears are that off!!! I don't hear that extra "va" syllable, and I am clearly hearing a "Ts" sound near the end.

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    Pravit, Brown writes in the Penguin course that the imperative forms can also be translated to English as a polite request -- "would you... or could you...". That is what I find difficult to chew, as that is so similar to the conditional "бы" constructions that we were discussing a few months ago.
    They can be translated that way, but at heart they're really imperatives. Бы is not used with Russian imperatives.

    "to repeat" is повторить...I understand that. My dictionary lists пробовать / попробовать as the spellings for the word "to try" when speaking of trying to taste something. Yet, I am certain that this second spelling is what I am hearing on my tapes when I am instructed to "try to say / ask". However, the dictionary gives me постараться as the correct word for "to try/attempt". From the dictionary, "постараться" should be the correct word usage for the context of these instructions -- No? That is what is leaving me with some lack of confidence in the audio lesson.
    There are two words for to try/to attempt. Cтараться gives me more of a feeling of making an effort at something("keep trying!"). Попробовать means to "give something a try" or "to try once." In this sense, they are asking you to give saying "x" word a try.

    What I hear may indeed be a "you" sound ( or "yah" sound) to the end of "try" - ую... But, I swear it seem like there is a "bat" sound which precedes any "oo" sound, thus попробать sticks in my mind. Or more like попроботаю... After years of music education, I don't think my ears are that off!!! I don't hear that extra "va" syllable, and I am clearly hearing a "Ts" sound near the end.
    What you are hearing is, as I said before, is most likely попробуйте. This is the imperative form of пропробовать conjugated for plural/formal.

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    Thank you so much Pavit... when you specify that попробуйте is in a formal plural imperative voice, that helps me get a grasp of what I am hearing. You want to try an alliteration of how you "hear" this word?!

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    No need to be sarcastic, I'm just trying to help. I had thought you wanted an explanation of what form this word is in, based off of this post:
    I think I am hearing the imperative form, not a perfective form of the verb.
    At any rate it would certainly help to know you are supposed to be hearing попробуйте, and not попробую, I hope.

    I thought people who used Pimsleur would be experts at phonetics, as DDT would like us to think. But as for the word попробуйте, you should hear something like this:
    pa - pro - bui - che/t'e

    If you are still confused about what you are hearing you can make a recording and post it here. Just make sure you don't get kindly old Dr. Pimsleur's lawyers after you for making recordings of their product

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    Pravit, you're right, but there's also a third way, in this case I think probably the least marked form of 'try' is пытаться.

    I have no idea what blueclue is talking about. It appears he is missing some study materials that should come with the audio media.

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    Whoops, forgot about пытаться. Mea culpa.

    It appears he is missing some study materials that should come with the audio media.
    The whole idea of Pimsleur is that these study materials should be missing.

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    Pravit, where did you get the idea I was being sarcastic?!! Simply "trying" to get all the help I can gather. Again, thank you so much.

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