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Thread: Chapter 27 questions

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    Chapter 27 questions

    Last chapter in my grammar book. Just a few questions here. The chapter is all about participles (present, past, active, passive, short, long...). Can someone check my answers on these?

    In this exercise, on present passive participles, I need to substitute an active voice который clause for the present passive participle.

    Дети иногда замечают вещи, не замечаемые взрослыми.
    Дети иногда замечают вещи, которых не замечают взрослые.


    In this exercise, I need to change from the active voice to the passive, using a short past passive participle.

    Моя работа ещё не (finished).
    Моя работа ещё не кончанась.

    And in this last exercise, I need to change from the short passive participial construction to the corresponding long construction.

    Студенты говорят о рассказе, который был прочитан вчера в классе.
    Студенты говорят о рассказе, прочитанном вчера в классе.

    Турист ищет очки, которые были потеряны им в соборе.
    Турист ищет очки, потерянные им в соборе.

    Почему ты не читал мне письма, которое было получено тобой вчера от Ивана?
    Почему ты не читал мне письма, полученного тобой вчера от Ивана?

    Я не знаком со всеми людьми, которые были приглашены к Петровым на вечер.
    Я не знаком со всеми людьми, приглашенными к Петровым на вечер.

    Thanks for any help,
    Z

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    Завсегдатай maxmixiv's Avatar
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    вещи, которых
    I'd say: вещи, которые

    Моя работа ещё не кончанась.
    Моя работа ещё не закончена (?) "Кончалась" is a ordinary verb, but I guess you were asked to provide short participle here.

    BTW,
    Почему ты не читал мне письма, которое было получено тобой вчера от Ивана?
    The question seems awkward, I'd say "почему ты не прочитал мне письмо, которое....
    From some very old book, may be...
    "Невозможно передать смысл иностранной фразы, не разрушив при этом её первоначальную структуру."

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    Quote Originally Posted by maxmixiv View Post
    The question seems awkward, I'd say "почему ты не прочитал мне письмо, которое....
    From some very old book, may be...

    Thanks for the help.

    Wouldn't письмо have to be in the genitive письма because it's the direct object of a negated verb?

    Z

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    Властелин iCake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zorro View Post
    Thanks for the help.

    Wouldn't письмо have to be in the genitive письма because it's the direct object of a negated verb?

    Z
    I understand your frustration. I think we have a bit of confusion on both sides in here.

    Take a look at this:

    письма - if the и sound is stressed it means letters.
    письма - if the а sound is stressed it means it's a letter in the genetive

    So, yes, you can say почему ты не читал мне письма, которое было получено тобой вчера от Ивана?

    but it's kind of uncommon to speak like that nowadays, so maxmixiv figured it was actually письма in there

    So given that I can say that you can say both я не читал письма and я не читал письмо. The last one is better and sounds more natural.

    If you still want to go with the first one just don't forget to stress the right syllable. The stress does matter, doesn't it?
    I do not claim that my opinion is absolutely true.
    If you've spotted any mistake in my English, please, correct it. I want to be aware of any mistakes to efficiently eliminate them before they become a habit.

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    maxmixiv figured it both ways

    Of course, Genitive письма is possible, but sounds bookish/old-fashioned to me.
    I can't explain it, because I don't know grammar rules, but here people usually say it in Accusative.
    "Невозможно передать смысл иностранной фразы, не разрушив при этом её первоначальную структуру."

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    Thanks maxmixiv and iCake and everyone else who has helped me get through this grammar book. I need to move on to trying to put together all these scattered pieces. Thanks again for sharing your time and knowledge.

    Z

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    So the book is finished?
    CONGRATULATIONS
    "Невозможно передать смысл иностранной фразы, не разрушив при этом её первоначальную структуру."

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    Quote Originally Posted by zorro View Post
    Wouldn't письмо have to be in the genitive письма because it's the direct object of a negated verb?
    The rules of using genitive and accusative with negated verbs are somewhat complicated.
    In that particular case, there should be accusative, because the direct object is definite ("the letter").
    Here is a detailed description: http://www.evartist.narod.ru/text1/66.htm#%D0%B7_04
    Hope it helps.

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    RedFox,

    Thanks for the link. That's really a great resource for detailed explanations of grammar. "Zorro" means "fox" in Spanish. Did you know that?

    Z

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    Quote Originally Posted by zorro View Post
    "Zorro" means "fox" in Spanish. Did you know that?
    Нет, не знал об этом.

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