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Thread: Please be patient with me

  1. #1
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    Please be patient with me

    Nominative sentence with nominative subject and predicate.

    For me, fresh picked sweet corn is one of the quintessential summer foods.

    На меня недавны сорваты кисло сладкий есть один классикие летние
    пищи.

    Спасибо!

  2. #2
    Почтенный гражданин xXHoax's Avatar
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    (Non-native Russian here, apply light salt)
    Sure, so let's break down the English sentence first:

    For me,

    fresh picked sweet corn

    is

    one of

    the quintessential summer foods

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "For me" is not translated as 'на'... It's hard to explain why...

    It's as if "for" in the sense of "designation of destination" turns into "на"

    для is more like "situational design." A book made "for kids" is 'designed for the benefit of' kids and would be для.

    "for me" in the sense of "In my situation" or "From my point of view" is more like "Для меня".

    Or you could use something like "по-моему" (in my opinion, lit.~ 'in my way') or "по моему мнению" (lit. 'along my opinion')

    You'll mainly just have to see a lot of situations where на is used as 'for' and gradually extract out the structure for it.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    fresh picked sweet corn

    'Picked' is an adjective, and is made (in both Russian and English, potentially) from a verb, which has been put into a "passive participle." This is an adjective derived from verbs, and one that denotes that the noun has "been VERBed"
    You would take the word for 'pick' (harvest, collect, etc.) and put it into the passive participle form, and match it's case+gender+number to the noun it is modifying--corn (nominative singular).

    fresh is modifying the "picked". A word modifying a verb or an adjective is an adverb, which in Russian will almost always be formed with the short-neuter form of the relating adjective.

    кисло means... Acidly or 'sour' so... Not sure what happened there lol.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    'is' is very often omitted entirely in the present tense.

    The Russian sentence will look like: "[NOUN PHRASE (nominative)] [NOUN PHRASE (nominative)]" and it will be understood that you are making an "A is B" sentence. (Technically speaking this is because you have two nominative nouns, meaning what would theoretically be two subjects of the sentence. Since the two 'subjects' are not followed by any other specified verb [conjugated in the plural], it is assumed that the only verb it could be is "to be")

    You are allowed to add a long dash, if you feel it will clarify that the sentence is conveying "A is B." You will probably have an urge to do this more than a Russian would, since they are used to the omission. Looks like "A — B."

    есть is possible, though you don't see it terribly often. In such situations есть functions as both either "is" or "are," since the plural form 'суть' is largely archaic. Probably, erase these from your mind for use in this type of case, because you'll have have a strong urge to use it often, despite it's rare use.

    In more complicated situations, "is" can manifest as words like "заключаться" ("Проблема заключается в том, что...") or "являться" ("Главным препятствием здесь является невнимание к этой проблеме." --one noun takes the subject, and the other takes instrumental., in the form "A (nom.) is B (instr.)". You'll notice that Russians often put the instrumental part first, which can really stretch the English mind.), among others, I'm sure.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    'One of' translates exactly how you would expect with a bit of extra specificity in Russian. In English we use 'of' for all kinds of things. In Russian, 'attribution' 'of' is mainly genitive. 'of' in the sense of 'out of' is always distinguished as "из."
    So "One (out) of", as is in fact what the sentence contains, translates as "один (одна, одной, одним, etc.) из +(genitive noun phrase)"

    In this case, as you mentioned, the sentence is a "A (nom) is B (nom)", plus some extra. This is correct, and in this case "один" will play our 'B', then "из центральных летних пищ" will come in to qualify the один

    Here's an example that touches on multiple of the above topics: "Одной из наиболее сложных проблем социального развития, стоящих сегодня перед странами, по-прежнему является старение."

    "One of the hardest problems of social development, standing today before countries, as before, is aging."
    You can see that the instrumental B for является comes first

    Из opens up a slot that must be filled with a noun. You can see a string of genitive words "сложных проблем социального развития." To parse this, you find the noun проблем which closes the phrase pertaining to the preposition 'из,' and now you now that the following genitive does not belong to the preposition, but rather is the standard attributive 'of' that genitive usually conveys.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "the quintessential summer foods", as said above, this noun phrase will be in the genitive.

    I'm not much help on vocab or word choice. Seems alright to me.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Keep at it, good stuff. Russian is really complicated but it's wonderful once you put your foot in the door for understanding these seemingly convoluted structures.

    Only relevant link I can think of:
    https://www.alphadictionary.com/rusg.../particip.html (Russian participles are typically considered "advanced" but I mean.... Earlier the start the better)
    Lampada and Soft sign like this.
    "В тёмные времена хорошо видно светлых людей."
    - A quote, that only exists in Russian. Erich Maria Remarque

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by xXHoax View Post
    (Non-native Russian here, apply light salt)

    fresh is modifying the "picked". A word modifying a verb or an adjective is an adverb, which in Russian will almost always be formed with the short-neuter form of the relating adjective.
    Right, except that the adverb "свеже" (fresh) merges with the next adjective (свежесорванный). You can also use "только что".

    Quote Originally Posted by xXHoax View Post

    'is' is very often omitted entirely in the present tense.

    The Russian sentence will look like: "[NOUN PHRASE (nominative)] [NOUN PHRASE (nominative)]" and it will be understood that you are making an "A is B" sentence. (Technically speaking this is because you have two nominative nouns, meaning what would theoretically be two subjects of the sentence. Since the two 'subjects' are not followed by any other specified verb [conjugated in the plural], it is assumed that the only verb it could be is "to be")

    You are allowed to add a long dash, if you feel it will clarify that the sentence is conveying "A is B." You will probably have an urge to do this more than a Russian would, since they are used to the omission. Looks like "A — B."

    есть is possible, though you don't see it terribly often. In such situations есть functions as both either "is" or "are," since the plural form 'суть' is largely archaic. Probably, erase these from your mind for use in this type of case, because you'll have have a strong urge to use it often, despite it's rare use.

    In more complicated situations, "is" can manifest as words like "заключаться" ("Проблема заключается в том, что...") or "являться" ("Главным препятствием здесь является невнимание к этой проблеме." --one noun takes the subject, and the other takes instrumental., in the form "A (nom.) is B (instr.)". You'll notice that Russians often put the instrumental part first, which can really stretch the English mind.), among others, I'm sure.
    The common way to say that is to use the word "это" (optional).

    Свежесорванная кукуруза - [это] ...

    Quote Originally Posted by xXHoax View Post
    "the quintessential summer foods", as said above, this noun phrase will be in the genitive.
    I'm not much help on vocab or word choice. Seems alright to me.
    Neither "пища" nor "еда" has plural genitive. So you have to rephrase that. For example:

    Свежесорванная кукуруза - одно из классических блюд летней кухни (one of classic dishes of summer cuisine)
    Lampada likes this.
    Налево пойдёшь - коня потеряешь, направо пойдёшь - сам голову сложишь.
    Прямой путь не предлагать!

  4. #4
    Властелин maxmixiv's Avatar
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    Полуношник, very well... but for me, your sentence does not fit with "For me", because it sounds more like the statement, valid for all, or the scientists' opinion.

    My try:

    Для меня, свежая кукуруза - это один из основных продуктов летом.
    "Невозможно передать смысл иностранной фразы, не разрушив при этом её первоначальную структуру."

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