Thread: Literature Talk: Russian & Non -Discuss/Review/Q&As

Originally Posted by emeraldeyez

I actually really liked What Is To Be Done. I liked the way this author wrote and how he kept me interested. I read the book through in one day. I could not put it down. It was interesting how the author would "narrate" or talk to his reading public, then switch back to the story and bring you "into" it.

Hmm... It's a bit strange to hear. This novell is written in quite a dry, non-artistic language. Of course, the translation must have been done in a better English. I read it long ago, and all I remember now is the terribly dry, formal style of the book. As far as I know, the author himself didn't consider his novell a work of art. He was not a writer, he was a публицист (Lingvo gives "writer of political essays" for this word).

I bought this book today at a shop in London:





I immediately liked Pushkin (whom I have not read before) after reading a few pages on tube (metro) home.

Originally Posted by translationsnmru

Originally Posted by gRomoZeka

Translation by Anastasia Zabrodina

What a horrorible translation. George's laureates...Oh, my.

Maybe Mayakovsky is just hard to translate well...?
Perhaps it sounds best in Russian. (Something is "lost in translation")

I read something by him in school and didn't like it at all...

The teacher loved Maykovsky and raved about his greatness and unique style. None of the students could understand why she liked it. But she happened to know Russian so maybe she had read it in Russian originally.

I have super-simple and unsophisticated taste in poetry. Something about nature, love, loneliness or patriotism that rhymes!

Originally Posted by Johanna

I have super-simple and unsophisticated taste in poetry. Something about nature, love, loneliness or patriotism that rhymes!

Then you definetely should read Pushkin's poetry in Russian. You can start from his fairytales:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsMUP9h17uI

Originally Posted by Johanna

I bought this book today at a shop in London:

The only thing I read from this is "Спать хочется" by Chekhov and it's not my favourite from his short stories.

"Станционный смотритель" I probably read but I don't remember what it was about at all. Pushkin's novels are quite good in general and very readable. Pushkin is, as the saying goes, "наше всё".

Originally Posted by Оля

This novell is written in quite a dry, non-artistic language. Of course, the translation must have been done in a better English. I read it long ago, and all I remember now is the terribly dry, formal style of the book. As far as I know, the author himself didn't consider his novell a work of art. He was not a writer, he was a публицист (Lingvo gives "writer of political essays" for this word).

I liked it to when I read it at school. I know it's criticised a lot and not considered great literature but I enjoyed its plot nonetheless.

I'm now making my way through "The Dead Souls"/"Мёртвые души" by Gogol. Haven't managed it at school.

Originally Posted by Johanna

I have super-simple and unsophisticated taste in poetry. Something about nature, love, loneliness or patriotism that rhymes!

Me and poetry don't go well together either. The only things I ever enjoyed were Pushkin's verses/fairy-tales but I think I'm starting to learn to appreciate it a bit more. I was really impressed by one poem/verse when I was a teen -- Rudyard Kipling's "If." It was my favourite for years.

If
If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you;
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or, being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or, being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise;

If you can dream - and not make dreams your master;
If you can think - and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with triumph and disaster
And treat those two imposters just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to broken,
And stoop and build 'em up with wornout tools;

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breath a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: "Hold on";

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with kings - nor lose the common touch;
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you;
If all men count with you, but none too much;
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run -
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man my son!

I personally love some of Mayakovsky's poems. He was a hooligan, an experimentalist. He was untamed and passionate about what he was doing, and you literally can see his time in his poetry. Even his ridiculous poem about Soviet passport, that caused a lot of salty jokes, is.. kinda cool. "I pull out of my wide trousers a duplicate of a priceless cargo... "

But one of my favourite Russian poets is Gumilev. His poems are pure magic: love and death, bright colours and moonlit lights, exotic countries and shamans, beautiful women and conquistadors.. I recommend him to anyone, who's a romantic (I'm not, but even I was enchanted). He also had an interesting, but tragic life.

Here are a few of his poems in English (not his best, though):
http://www.poetryloverspage.com/yevgeny/gumilev/
And a huge collection of his poems in Russian. Try them on random, maybe you'll like something:
http://gumilev.ru/verses/line/all/

I think his poems are rather easy to understand for a Russian learner. Just an example:

Сон. Утренняя болтовня

Вы сегодня так красивы,
Что вы видели во сне?
— Берег, ивы при луне..

А еще? К ночному склону
Не приходят, не любя.
— Дездемону и себя..

Вы глядите так несмело:
Кто там был за купой ив?
— Был Отелло, он красив..

Был ли он вас двух достоин?
Был ли он как лунный свет?
— Да, он воин и поэт.

О какой же пел он ныне
Неоткрытой красоте?
— О пустыне и мечте.

И вы слушали влюбленно,
Нежной грусти не тая?
— Дездемона, но не я. —

These ones are nice and easy too:
Принцесса
Отравленный

Tell me what you think of him, if you decide to try it, Johanna.

Originally Posted by gRomoZeka

Even his ridiculous poem about Soviet passport, that caused a lot of salty jokes, is.. kinda cool. "I pull out of my wide trousers a duplicate of a priceless cargo... "

Я достаю из широких штанин
Нечто похожее на дуло танка
Смотрите, завидуйте - я гражданин,
А не какая-то там гражданка!

Originally Posted by Basil77

Я достаю из широких штанин
Нечто похожее на дуло танка
Смотрите, завидуйте - я гражданин,
А не какая-то там гражданка!

Классика жанра.

А мы еще такие стишки Маяковского в школе проходили (это оригинал ):

Лошадь сказала, взглянув на верблюда:
"Какая гигантская лошадь-ублюдок".
Верблюд же вскричал: "Да лошадь разве ты?!
Ты просто-напросто - верблюд недоразвитый".
И знал лишь бог седобородый,
что это - животные разной породы.

В общем, человек развлекался, как мог.. ))

Originally Posted by Basil77

Originally Posted by Johanna

I have super-simple and unsophisticated taste in poetry. Something about nature, love, loneliness or patriotism that rhymes!

Then you definetely should read Pushkin's poetry in Russian. You can start from his fairytales:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsMUP9h17uI

That is LOVELY. Thank you so much for posting it.

I saw so many great Russian cartoons in my childhood but it's hard to remember which was which and what they were called. I don't think I have seen that one before - what a loss, it's beautiful!

I am beginning to really like Pushkin. I had thought he was "too sophisticated/advanced" for my simple taste in literature and poetry. Maybe I just hadn't "given him a chance..."

Speaking about kids stuff from Russia... Peter and the Wolf! Was this famous in other countries too? If anyone from the US, Germany etc reads this, can you remember a play / story by this name? It was a sort of "interactive musical" for children - classical music + fairytale.

EDIT: British Peter and the Wolf: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QKPk...eature=related

Starrysky: Yes -- Kipling is one of the few poets I appreciate in English. I am willing to admit that Shakespeare is not among them but I probably would be kicked out of the country if an English person heard me say that... The language is too inaccessible. I think his PLOTS are good though, I just can't stand reading it, or listening to that type of old fashioned stiff English.

Gromozeka: No Gromilev does not appeal to me in English and I can't read Russian well enough yet.. But like I said, poetry is largely lost on me unless it's 100% straight forward..
I would like to be a person who can really enjoy poetry... But sadly I am not.

But because you recommend him, I will add this to my "Russian poets" list to read in Russian in the future - along with Anna Akhmatova.

I also believe that most people are only truly able to appreciate poetry in their own native language as we have discussed here previously.

Originally Posted by Johanna

No Gumilev does not appeal to me in English and I can't read Russian well enough yet..

But because you recommend him, I will add this to my "Russian poets" list to read in Russian in the future - along with Anna Akhmatova.

He was her husband, by the way.

I love Gumilev, too.

Salinger died

Yes... Well, at least he lived to be 92.

It's strange but somehow "The Catcher in The Rye" never fails to lift my mood. Strange, because Holden seems to be depressed and whining through the whole book but somehow there is humour in it...

But actually "The Catcher in the Rye" is a bit demoralising for those that read it (teenagers). It confirms their feelings that the world and a lot of people in it are "phony", "fake" and "cheesy".

I remember being incredibly disillusioned with everything while reading this book. I *really* identified with Holden because my situation at the time had a lot in common with his life. I started feeling like an outsider, similar to Holden. Not sure this was such a great outcome.

The man who shot John Lennon somehow linked the shooting to the book (not quite sure how). But when he was caught he kept talking about this book. Not a good sign!

It's also unclear if the book has a happy ending. Holden is sent to some kind of clinic for children with emotional issues (not clarified in details). He mentions that he'll be attending another boarding school (despite the fact that he had been expelled from a number of schools previously.) It's not hard to imagine that he'll just be heading for another failure unless he is able to change his attitude.

I agree that it is a genius book. But is it a good book to read?

Yes, it's all true. There was a guy at my uni who liked this book very much and clearly identified with Holden -- he was really whacky. Like, once we had to hand in our end of term paper (an analysis of a literary text). He didn't do it and offered to read something he has written instead. It's possible that he's an unacknowledged genius but that kind of attitude is just not one that's gonna help in life... At least, hating everyone because they're phony is not an outlook I really share. I can definitely relate to it in part -- that's why I liked the book -- but not to the extent he went.

I read "The Catcher" when I was about 17, in English. First of all, I enjoyed the language a lot. I thought something along the lines: "That guy's really strange." I didn't identify with him but I felt a lot of sympathy for him nonetheless. He reminded me of my elder brother a bit. This book wasn't in any way harmful for me, because I was quite mature when reading it. I'd read "Quiet Flows the Don" just before it and after reading about so much suffering and struggling, it seemed that Holden was kinda making mountains out of molehills, or something.

At any rate, I'm glad that book exists.

Lolita...anyone read this. I'm abandoning it after 50 pages. His writing style is very annoying and unusual, long sentences, page long paragraphs but with very little content, just a lot of words. Half the time I have no idea what he's talking about plus he goes into long digressions that add nothing to the flow of the story.

Lolita by Vladimir Nabokov. Yes, I read it when I was a about 15 or so.. I read it purely because I found out that it was explicitly banned from my schools' library.

Parts of it were ok, but obviously I had no understanding or sympathy for the male perspective in the book at all, and was much more interested in Lolita's perspective. But really, the book is about the male view, so it was probably lost on me...

Frankly Lolita was incredibly annoying and not very well portrayed. The mother was annoying too. It was hard to understand what all the fuss was about, I found the plot boring and the language irritating (I read the Swedish translation). I made it to the end but I have forgotten it...

Judging by todays' standards when peadophiles are the new witches... (burn 'em!) the book is terribly politically incorrect. Nabokov had moved to the US when he wrote the book, if I remember correctly, and the book was originally written in English, not in Russian.

Originally Posted by sperk

Lolita...anyone read this. I'm abandoning it after 50 pages. His writing style is very annoying and unusual, long sentences, page long paragraphs but with very little content, just a lot of words. Half the time I have no idea what he's talking about plus he goes into long digressions that add nothing to the flow of the story.

I'm surprised to hear that because Nabokov is famous with his brilliant language in his prose (I don't like his poetry though). Probably he was great in prose only when he wrote in Russian. However, I read 'Lolita' (in Russian, of course), and I found the language really brilliant. Actually, it's the main virtue of the novel. I don't mean I didn't find the plot interesting; but the language is what is the best about the novel. I can say the same about his other things, by the way.

Originally Posted by Johanna

Lolita by Vladimir Nabokov. Yes, I read it when I was a about 15 or so.. I read it purely because I found out that it was explicitly banned from my schools' library.

That's really funny, because I read it when I was about 15 too, BUT because it was in our school reading list.
I even had to retell in front of the class the story of Humbert and Lolita's first sexual intercourse (you know, to prove that I read the book). Tell me now, that Soviet schools were boring!

But I totally agree with Olya - Nabokov's "Lolita" (in Russian) is absolutely brilliant! He's creative with words, but he manages to avoid turning his narrative into something pretentious or unnatural. When he needs an epithet he never uses the first (or even second or third) word that comes to mind (no clichés). He choses something absolutely unexpected and seemingly unsuitable, but it works wonderfully. You literally can see a picture in your mind, it's so descriptive and emotional. His novels must have been very hard to translate.. I wonder if they are any good in English (he wrote both English and Russian version)?

Interesting that you are sepaking about Nabokov and Lolita... I came across this site while helping my daughter with her paper about Sikorsky..
http://englishrussia.com/?p=3141
6 Russian People Who Changed the USA

Vladimir Nabokov (22 April, 1899 – 2 July, 1977) was the great Russian novelist. He emigrated from Russia to England (1919), then to Germany (1922), and then to the USA (1940), where he settled down in Manhattan. He never wrote in Russian after he came to the USA, though translated his works in English into Russian.

Nabokov’s Lolita (1955) is considered to be one of the most prominent novels in literature. How much influence this word caused on the human minds we all can only guess now. He also was interested in entomology and chess problems.