First off all we should seperate muslims from hezbollah.Hezbollah is on the extreme point.I'm a muslim,and my perception of Islam is totally different from them.And also most of muslims in Turkey agree with me.
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First off all we should seperate muslims from hezbollah.Hezbollah is on the extreme point.I'm a muslim,and my perception of Islam is totally different from them.And also most of muslims in Turkey agree with me.
[quote=Kamion]But if the media informs the public that there are many heat-related deaths at the moment, than people can exercise extra caution. You canQuote:
Originally Posted by Mordan
There really should be change in the Middle East. I'm tired of hearing about bombings and shootings happening on the news. Why couldn't everyone just live in peace? It's way easier. But no, people are too greedy and selfish to realize it.Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerKiss
today there was a interesting article at lenta.ru..."ixbt.com was hacked by Arabian hackers" http://www.lenta.ru/news/2006/07/28/hack/
But later, owners of "ixbt" said, what "it was only joke"...i`m not sure in it, thought... 8)
Conflict is necessary to keep arabs in a "stone-age" without industry, technologies and power. Nobody in the West really wants solid and developed Middle East on the world map.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kim_2320
That's where Israel fits - that's the "splinter" in the ass unable to be torn out and nagging constantly. This it the instrument using which one coudld really keep arabs under control.
Policy is fun, isn't it?
Because people are fighting not for those kidnapped soldiers and even not with terrorism, they are fighting for land and authority in the region.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kim_2320
Moreover, if Israel wants just to protect itself from Hezbolluh terrorists why the hell they bombed the only one international airport, roads, bridges and fuel reservoirs that led to the ecological disaster in Lebanon!!???!!!
And finally, this is not the question of religion. 40% of lebanese are chrisitian.
Oh Summerkiss, so pretty but knows nothing of war!
In war they bomb the all the things that tie their enemy to their friends and supply lines. That means, in this case, bridges and roads that lead to Syria or reinforcements, communications systems and yes, even airports.
Anyway, my dear, what did you come here to MR for? To start all this trouble.....Hmmm? Perhaps you are a spy sent by another Russian language site in order to stir up trouble with the peaceful citizens of MasterRussian......hmmm.!!!???? :cool2:
I mean i haven't seen her make a post related to Russian language yet!!!! .......oh well!
There's nothing revelatory about this observation. Tens of thousands of people die in car accidents every year, people are murdered, raped and tortured every day somewhere in the world. Just because we know this, is no justification for becoming desensitized or indifferent to images or reports of human suffering in places like Lebanon, or elsewhere. Yes, human life is cheap in this world, it's snuffed out without a thought every minute of every day but if we become totally indifferent to it, then we cease to be fully human and become more like the leaders and governments that perpetuate these conflicts for their own selfish ends. It should stop us from becoming overemotional or too carried away with our response and maintain a perspective on things, but not indifferent and unmoved.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordan
Lebanon has only recently escaped the control of Syria and still remains in its shadow to a large degree. It's also an ethnically diverse country. The Lebanese army is weaker and less well-equipped than Hezbollah. To think you can just bomb Lebanon into taking on Hezbollah is crazy. You're more likely to boost support for them (while the bombing campaign is in progress anyway). If this was a more homogeneous and powerful state like Egypt that was harbouring Hezbollah, then perhaps Israel's approach to the conflict might make a bit more sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordan
В том случае, если человек, которого ты ненавидишь, украл у тебя перо, ты избил бы его насмерть?
Как россияне относятся к этой теме?Quote:
I mean i haven't seen make a post related to Russian launguae yet!!!! .......oh well!
Relax, DDT. The Isreali-Lebanon conflict is all over the news. It's only natural the topic would come up eventually. I don't think SummerKiss came to start trouble, especially with such a passive name. She did say she was looking to practice her English, and talking about what's happening on the news is good practice.
Of course, casualties are part of war, but one can also be excessive in war and over-react, especially the one with all the modern weapons, as they can do far more harm with less effort. If a criminal takes a civilian hostage, you shouldn't kill the civilian along with the criminal just to get the criminal. Of course, that's easier said than done, especially in war.
Many Lebanese are Christian, yes. But Hezbollah is a militant Islamic group. I think it is about land and religion. In the Middle East, it's difficult to set aside religion as a major factor for many things.
SummerKiss?Quote:
Originally Posted by mashamania
:lol:
for me this name only smells trouble 8)
Please oh please don't say it's about oil. :lol: Somebody on bbcrussian.com got their comment posted on the main site concerning this conflict that as long as there is oil in the middle east there will be war. You can't compare this situation with the IRAQ Conflict Arguments. It's an apple and an orange of a difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerKiss
Oh and Israel's retaliation is not just for these 2 soldiers, it's more or less for years of continued terrorist attacks that seem to happen every week over a period of many years. Anyone want to count up all the dead innocent civilians there?
And please don't say that Israel is interested in conquering Lebanon's territory. Also, keep in mind that Israel in the past has forced its own citizens out of large territories of land in a gesture for peace.
This guy knows the truth. He was a PLO Terrorist but has since become an advocate for Israel.
http://www.shoebat.com/bio.phphttp://www.shoebat.com/images/walid_1.jpg
Quote:
In 1993, Walid studied the Tanach (Jewish Bible) in a challenge to convert his wife to Islam. Six months later, after intense study, Walid realized that everything he had been taught about Jews was a lie. Convinced he was on the side of evil, he became an advocate for his former enemy.
Объективным быть можно. Но если кто-то говорит, что он "За Израиль" или "За Ливан", то объективизма здесь нет никакого.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lampada
самоидентификация Sorry for that typo :oops:
The media only seems to want to tell The Arab side of the story these days. It seems that the younger a person is the more he or she hates Israel.
Let’s not forget at this time that almost one million Jews were expelled from Arab countries in 1948. Watch the trailer. http://www.shoebat.com/trailer_exodus.php
http://www.pierrerehov.com/exodus.htm
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14082298/
Now lets quote a song by adam and dave
"What I like about jews, they're real cool guys. Abused by the Germans and the Romans but they took it in stride! Yea!"
Ok that was a joke, but the matter at hand here Isn't. It seems like most other countries know how to forgive and forget, But radical islam can't and won't. Thats why when this sh*t happens, it has to be stopped at its roots. Nothing against the people and the innocent citizens of Muslim countries. I go to school everyday and learn from some pretty cool people who are from Afghanistan. 2 are doctors, many other have worked for the red cross, or BBC or CNN. They watch "Married with children" and quote Seinfeld. One even had family killed by the taliban and was arrested and shot before escaping and comming here to America.
Nobody has anything personal against the Ismlamic fath, its radicals in general. It sucks that innocent people on both sides, in both Lebenon and Isreal have to die. But if its to get people like this guy and thousands others off the streets, or killed. Then its what has to be done. It wont stop unless somebody stops it.
Once again, its not the Jews, or the Buddhists, or Christians (as scary as they are) who are indescrimanantly killing innocent people, its the radicam muslims and countries who support them need to be gone.
[/quote]Anyway, my dear, what did you come here to MR for? To start all this trouble.....Hmmm? Perhaps you are a spy sent by another Russian language site in order to stir up trouble with the peaceful citizens of MasterRussian......hmmm.!!!???? :cool2:
I mean i haven't seen her make a post related to Russian language yet!!!! .......oh well![/quote]
I came here to improve my english and to discuss the topics which I am interested in. I wanted to know the opinion of other people here and I did it. If you dont want to take part in "all this trouble" just dont answer. And if you look better you'll find my other topics.
You english is pretty good =)
Догбой, а кому принадлежит эта бандитская рожа на твоём аватаре? :?: :D :D :D
And it doesn't sound like you know anything about Christianity.Quote:
Originally Posted by DDT
We can argue all day long about what bad things Christians did and what bad things Muslims did, so I think that it is better to go straight to the source and judge the actions of Jesus against Mohammed.
Jesus:
Never had an army.
Never killed anyone.
Never ordered anyone to kill anyone.
Never stole anything.
Never raped anyone.
Never told his deciples it was ok to rape anyone.
Never was a child molestor.
Said, "Treat people the manner that you would want them to treat you."
"Love your enemies."
Mohammed:
Built a great army.
Went on about 20 campaigns of war, killing and mutilating as he went.
Ordered the death of hundred or thousands of prisoners. (900 Jews in one place)
Stole and looted camel trains or caravans to finance his first expeditions.
Raped women after first hacking the husbands into pieces in front of them.
Told his warriors that Allah said it was OK for them to rape hunreds captive women as long as they didn't ejaculate in them.
Had sex with an 8 or 9 year old girl who still played her dolls, when he was 56 years old. Her name was Aisha.
Said:
Christians and Jews are nothing more than pigs and apes. Search them out ant kill them where ever you find them.
So before you go equating Christianity with Islam and then "throwing the baby out with the bath water" I suggest you dig quite a bit deeper than where ever you have been digging.[/quote:324iesdl]
Where did you read all that about muhammed??? It seems to be a special Karan.
:) спасибоQuote:
Originally Posted by Dogboy182
your * :D :D :P oops.
Well its mine ofcourse! On one of my many vacations to the steppes of kazakhstan.Quote:
Догбой, а кому принадлежит эта бандитская рожа на твоём аватаре
Nice pic!Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogboy182
Next time you are there take a pic of medeo.
What does здрасте mean in your signature?
It is so popular, it makes me regret that I am not an arms dealer.Quote:
Originally Posted by basurero
Quote:
Originally Posted by basurero
I dont even know if its a real word. Its just a shorter, (cooler) more impolite way to say Здраствуйте (did i mention easier?).
Ive only ever really heard it in songs, or teenagers talking. But hey, songs, and teenagers are cool. So, i guess its cool.
Здрасте здрасте, я ваш догбой
поверьте мне, я ж не голубой...
he he he :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Dogboy182
Ну, здрасте, приехали!!!
hey i guess alware says it too!
So i was right after all, cool people say it. 8)
Жаль что уехал так рано из радного казахстана...
я шас живу в маленькой области, которая называется "Вобля".
Люди всегда смеются надо мной, когда узнавают я и откуда... Но я говорю в ответ... "Ну что ***".
Its just a river :wink:
Well, I don't think Gaza counts as a large territory. With its 1.5 million or so Palestinian inhabitants, it was total fantasy to think that Israeli settlement there could ever achieve anything (not unless the long term intention was to expel the existing population into Egypt or something like that). So I assume you're talking about the Sinai area. Well, that did secure peace with Egypt and proves that a "land for peace" deal can work, and remember Egypt was Israel's greatest enemy in earlier wars. If someone suggested in the 1950s or 60s that Egypt would accept Israel's existence, they would probably have been dismissed as mad.Quote:
Originally Posted by uno
As regards Lebanon, I don't think anyone is suggesting Israel wants to conquer its territory but clearly Israel has a different attitude to the West Bank. The course of the wall and the expansion of settlements prove that. And ultimately all these conflicts are interconnected, An outbreak of violence on one front can trigger clashes on another. There has to be a comprehensive peace deal for the Middle East that addresses all outstanding issues, including Syria, Lebanon and the Palestinians.
Israel might say that they have no partner to negotiate with, and it's true that while Hamas refuses to accept the existence of Israel and to renounce violence there is little hope of peace. But Israel's determination to continue building settlements and annexing land on the West Bank is also a huge obstacle to agreement. Locking up 2.5 million Palestinians behind walls into pockets of land in the West Bank, enveloping them inside the state of Israel but without any voice in that state is insane. It's also immoral and totally unworkable.
And lastly, you don't have to expand settlements and deny Palestinians their own state in order to keep Israel secure. Any agreement could still see Israeli forces along the Jordan valley to ensure no weapons or rockets got through to those opposed to the peace.
I think the reason why the wall makes inroads into the West Bank is just to keep Jewish settlements on the Israeli side of the wall. Israel is small, yes, but it has lots of space, it is nowhere near full. Israel doesn't currently have any need for more land. The only reason it would want to take extra land is for buffer zones. As soon as Israel pulled out of Gaza, millitants started firing rockets out into Israel.
The original plan the British came up with was to divide Palestine 50-50 between the Jews and Arabs, with Jerusalem as a UN adiminstered multi-faith city. The Jews agreed, but the Arabs said they wanted all or nothing.
Also, we must remember that after the Arabs invaded Israel from all sides in the 60s, Israel pushed them all back and captured huge amounts of land (like the Sinai Peninsula which is bigger than Israel itself). But Israel gave it all back (except the Golan heights, which was to act as a buffer zone between Israel and Syria).
I do not particularly agree with what Israel is doing right now, but Israel is in a difficult and unique position. It is surrounded by countries that hate it and want it destroyed. Eygpt officially does not, but the people of Eygpt do. If Israel seems weak to countries like Iran and Syria, they'll try and invade or bomb it. What Israel is doing at the moment is sending a message to Iran, Syria, and everyone else in the region, that they don't take no sh*t from anyone. Of course, thousands of civillians on both sides have take the direct consequences.
Well my little possum, one can find everything one wants about Koran, Hadith and Mohammed here:-Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerKiss
http://mb-soft.com/believe/txo/islam.htm
http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/index.html
http://www.prophetofdoom.net/
http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/index. ... Q&id_cat=3
YouQuote:
Originally Posted by DDT
Well if you think about it Kamion, there really are no rules in war. War is the proof that, on Earth, there are no enforcable rules.
It is only in recent history that anyone gives a hoot about "collateral damage". Take WWII for example. Civilian deaths were more or less ignored. ie Bombing of London, Dresden, Berlin, Pearl Harbour, Darwin, Hiroshima.
Perhaps it could even be said that when civilians know that they will get killed too, along with their armies, they will be less likely to start a war in the first place!
No problem for me: with the victim and against the opressor. Yesterderday the opressor was Hitler, against Hitler. Nobody wants to know which was the behaviour of every country towards the Jews when Hitler was in the power (USA, Switzerland, as well as many other countries have reasons for not speaking about it); after WWII they accord (out of their bad conscience) being splendid giving them Palestine, why not Arizona, Baden-Wurtenberg; Sicily or Scotland ?. It is easy make charity with other's pocket. From then on the victim becames executioner. And every day more.
One thing is Jewish people and other completely different is the State of Israel, as well as a grandfather can be a very honest person and the grandson a delinquent, and v.v. As for 'the terrorist'; it is a word who indicates a delinquent if he loses and a hero if he wins. Terrorist is whoever fights against me. Terrorist where called in their era and by the occupant, of course, the americans who opposed with weapons to the presence of Spanish power in America, now they are heroes; the Spaniards who opposed to the presence of Napoleon in Spain, now they are heroes ; the Jews who opposed to the presence of British power in Palestine, now they are heroes. the French who opposed to presence of German troops in France; now they are heroes. the Russians who fighted in civil dress against occupier; etc, etc.
Yeah, maybe you're right. But I'm mostly talking about the US wars.Quote:
Originally Posted by SummerKiss
Jews used to live and at the time lived in the area that became Israel. There was once a Jewish civilisation there. So saying "Why not give them land in Europe or America" doesn't really work. Also Israel is a very small piece of land with very few natural resources, (no oil etc.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladi
The Arabs don't really care about the land itself, what they care about is Jews living in there region. It's not because of what Israel is doing in the Gaza Strip or West Bank, or what it is doing in Lebannon now. All they care about is that they are Jews and in "their region", and they want them out. As soon as the State of Israel was declared the Arab countries invaded.
You're being wrong in definition of terrorism.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vladi
It's the form of POWER based on POLITICAL violence. The word Terror means fear. It is the policy of inspiring fear in people to achieve your goals. That needs to be distinguished from military action which goal is to eliminate enemy activities. Terrorists bombs schools and bus stops, but rocket attacks of Hezbollah resembles more an aggression that terrorism. Indeed the attacks come from another country.
Neither terrorism label can be sticked on Israel for it's just strikes back. The conflict has nothing to do with terrorism. It's just a simple war.
I am not so sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramil
Israel is striking millitary targets. The problem is Hizbullah is woven into Lebanese society, so to hit Hizbullah, you have to hit residential areas.
Hizbullah on the other hand are just trying to kill Israeli civillians by firing rockets into Israeli towns and cities.
Also, Hizbullah is not acting on behalf of Lebannon officially, and is therefore considered to be carrying out terrorist actions.
Yes, it's hard to see why Israel needs to develop so many new communities in a disputed area when there's plenty of land within Israel itself. I think there's more to it than just buffer zones though. There is a strong ideologically driven movement within Israel that sees all of the West Bank as rightfully belonging to the Jewish state. It has pushed for and succeeded in establishing numerous settlements throughout the West Bank since that territory was captured in the 1967 war. These settlements necessitate a significant military presence to protect them and result in a major impact on Palestinian life through checkpoints, delays and travel restrictions etc. This only fuels more resentment and bitterness towards the Israeli presence among Palestinians. Also, the settlers are often very hardline and extreme in their views and some have carried out attacks on Palestinian civilians in the past. All in all, it doesn't seem like a good policy for promoting peace and harmony given past history!Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
Yes, this was wrong and doesn't help the Palestinian cause one bit. But the shelling of civilians on a beach in northern Gaza a few weeks ago didn't help either. I believe that was the reason Hamas gave for breaking its truce.Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
The Arabs should have accepted that but regardless of what should have happened in the past there's still an issue to be addressed in the present. Israel acquired not just more land in the 67 war but also a large Palestinian population. What is it going to do now? Keep them under military rule forever? Give them the same rights as Israeli Arabs and make them full citizens of Israel? or give them their own state? If they are to have their own state then it should be a real viable state and not some fragmented entity encircled by walls and Israeli settlements.Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
Israel was willing to give up most of the Golan Heights for a peace deal with Syria but talks reached an impasse over control of the right bank of Lake Tiberias, I think. There are settlements in the Golan Heights as well but no large Arab population (most fled during the war).Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
Yeah, Israel is in a difficult position with people like Ahmadinejad saying the crazy things he does but it's not helping matters the way it treats the Palestinians. And every injustice that ensues from that unresolved conflict is beamed around the Arab world increasing the animosity towards Israel among the public in countries like Egypt. If the Palestinian issue had been settled the same time as the peace with Egypt, there mightn't be the daily diet of shootings and attacks that we have today and many moderate Muslims might have come to accept Israel. I mean there are Muslim Israeli citizens who live quite happily there so it shouldn't be impossible.Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
If government cannot control its land/population that means that its power is weak.Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
The core of the discussion is WHY Hezbollah is marking civilian targets? To inspire fear in Jews? I really doubt it. Who pays them? And WHY?