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Thread: vladimir ulyanov (lenin)

  1. #41
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    Re: Ленин

    Quote Originally Posted by Светлана Ежова
    By the way, you don't believe in socialism? I mean real socialism, not the pretend stuff the USSR had, but real socialism as a theory?
    Probably, you should explain the difference between "stuff the USSR" had and "real socialism". Is there any real country with real socialism in existance, just to make comparison?

    Quote Originally Posted by Светлана Ежова
    I am a leftist. I visit the anti-communist action board to debate with the people who support capitalism. I don't like Lenin because I feel that Lenin's beliefs were a poor example of what a socialist country should be like.
    The Lenin is only known good example of what a real socialist country can be created. Alas, it's a fact. ;(

    Quote Originally Posted by Светлана Ежова
    (Of course it would be totally unfair for me to say I don't like "Bolsheviks" because Bukharin was one and I really like him. That's why I never try to generalize.)
    I wonder, why do you like him so much?
    Кр. -- сестр. тал.

  2. #42
    mike
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    Re: Ленин

    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpio
    The Lenin is only known good example of what a real socialist country can be created. Alas, it's a fact. ;(
    Depends on your definition of socialism. In politics, different definitions of words used by political figures are not in short supply.

    Lenin's definition: "Or, in other words, socialism is merely state capitalist monopoly which is made to serve the interests of the whole people and has to that extent ceased to be capitalist monopoly." This quote is taken from a pamphlet of his called "The Impending Catastrophe and How To Combat It." He also says " For if a huge capitalist undertaking becomes a monopoly, it means that it serves the whole nation. If it has become a state monopoly, it means that the state (i.e., the armed organisation of the population, the workers and peasants above all, provided there is revolutionary democracy) directs the whole undertaking. In whose interest?"

    The synthesis of these quotes, as well as State and Revolution (which I am not going to sit here and look up relevant quotes from), leads to two conclusions:

    1) Lenin's definition of socialism is markedly different from the traditional one of "the workers controlling the means of production; from each according to their ability, to each according to their need." His version is, "the state will monopolize everything and you are just going to have to hope your say in the matter as a worker amounts to something in policy-making." Or perhaps a more honest but less objective way of putting it is: "Your old boss is gone. Why not celebrate by working extra hard for your new one?"

    2) Even by his own definition the Soviet Union failed to live up to socialist expectations. The USSR hardly was a "revolutionary-democratic" system. In fact, it became precisely the "reactionary-bureaucratic state" that he claimed protected the interests of the landowners and capitalists rather than the proletariat and distinguished state capitalism from state socialism.

    I always assumed The Who song Won't Get Fooled Again was about the USSR, but I am not sure. Maybe it is just about revolutions in general

    There's nothing in the streets
    Looks any different to me
    And the slogans are replaced, by the by.
    And the party on the left
    Is now the party on the right
    And their beards have all grown longer overnight

    ...

    Meet the new boss:
    Same as the old boss

  3. #43
    DDT
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    Pete Townsend had a habit of leaning back on his Marshall stack while playing guitar. A guy I knew had found Townsends favourite stage shirt, forgotten in the dressing rooms at The Cavern and returned it to him a week or so later. Pete was so happy he asked the guy to go on the road with him. One of his jobs was to stand behind Townsends stack and "Push back" while Pete was leaning on it. One time, Townsend stood up straight and walked off to the front of the stage quickly and the amplifier stack was pushed over onto the stage in front of the audience..

    Sorry, your metion of that song brings back memories.
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

  4. #44
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    Re: Ленин

    [quote=Scorpio]
    Quote Originally Posted by Светлана Ежова
    By the way, you don't believe in socialism? I mean real socialism, not the pretend stuff the USSR had, but real socialism as a theory?
    Probably, you should explain the difference between "stuff the USSR" had and "real socialism".

    Sveta replies: Jee whiz, you're asking me to write a book here. Actually, there will be a page about that on my website where I'll be writing about exactly that so your question will be answered!

    Is there any real country with real socialism in existance, just to make comparison?

    Sveta replies: I would definitely say "Нет" Of course maybe someone else has a different opinion, but that's mine.

    Quote Originally Posted by "Светлана Ежова":2p118xui
    I am a leftist. I visit the anti-communist action board to debate with the people who support capitalism. I don't like Lenin because I feel that Lenin's beliefs were a poor example of what a socialist country should be like.
    The Lenin is only known good example of what a real socialist country can be created. Alas, it's a fact. ;(

    Sveta replies: I don't agree with you on that one but whatever....

    Quote Originally Posted by Светлана Ежова
    (Of course it would be totally unfair for me to say I don't like "Bolsheviks" because Bukharin was one and I really like him. That's why I never try to generalize.)
    I wonder, why do you like him so much?[/quote:2p118xui]

    Sveta replies: I will explain that one too on my website. Unfortunately since I am in university right now I don't have the time to work on either of my websites.
    The bureaucracy exists to serve the people; the people don't exist to serve the bureaucracy."- N. I. Bukharin

  5. #45
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    Re: Ленин

    [quote=Светлана Ежова]
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpio
    Quote Originally Posted by "Светлана Ежова":37j46xn7
    (Of course it would be totally unfair for me to say I don't like "Bolsheviks" because Bukharin was one and I really like him. That's why I never try to generalize.)
    I wonder, why do you like him so much?
    Sveta replies: I will explain that one too on my website. Unfortunately since I am in university right now I don't have the time to work on either of my websites. [/quote:37j46xn7]

    Among all famous Bukharin's quotations, this is the one I like most:

    "У нас многопартийная система: одна партия у власти, а остальные в тюрьме."

    "We have a true multiparty system: one party at power, all others in jail."
    Кр. -- сестр. тал.

  6. #46
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    Re: Ленин

    [quote=Scorpio]
    Quote Originally Posted by Светлана Ежова
    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpio
    Quote Originally Posted by "Светлана Ежова":e1zixm0w
    (Of course it would be totally unfair for me to say I don't like "Bolsheviks" because Bukharin was one and I really like him. That's why I never try to generalize.)
    I wonder, why do you like him so much?
    Sveta replies: I will explain that one too on my website. Unfortunately since I am in university right now I don't have the time to work on either of my websites.
    Among all famous Bukharin's quotations, this is the one I like most:

    "У нас многопартийная система: одна партия у власти, а остальные в тюрьме."

    "We have a true multiparty system: one party at power, all others in jail."[/quote:e1zixm0w]

    Hee! That about summed it up, too! That's a good quote, too!

    I also liked this quote from him:
    "Peasants enrich yourselves, develop your farms, and don't worry that they will be taken away from you."
    NI Bukharin, 1925
    The bureaucracy exists to serve the people; the people don't exist to serve the bureaucracy."- N. I. Bukharin

  7. #47
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    There is no denying the faults and problems that were directly related to Lenin's leadership, however he was the first who dared apply what had only been discussed as theory into practise. For that, I admire him. Btw, it gets right on my t!ts those who blame him for Stalin since he clearly stated that he didn't want Stalin to succeed him.
    Tes yeux brillent si fort
    Comme moi quand je suis plein
    Bouff

  8. #48
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    What do you mean by this expression?
    Btw, it gets right on my t!ts
    Листьев не обожгло, Веток не обломало
    День промыт как стекло, только этого мало

  9. #49
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    It pisses her off, in other words.

    There are other expressions using "tits"(most of them British, I've noted).

    "better than a kick in the tits" - really good
    "things have gone tits-up" - things have gone to sh*t

    There are probably some others I've forgotten.

  10. #50
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    What I think of when I hear the "gets on my t!ts" phrase;

    "No wonder you're always gettin' slapped in the t!ts!"- is an improv. line by a friend in my younger brother's movie. His character said it to a guy who regularly tried to hold-up his disposals store with a butter knife. He was then told by my brother's character, also being held-up, "I'll give you the money, so long as you use it to buy yourself a decent knife from our quality selction". So, the guy went into the changing room to 'try them on', mimicking stabs in the mirror. He eventually said "No, they're just not me" to the hunting knives, and "I've got a routine going with this", about his butter knife. So, he gave the money back and was told not to come back unless he has "a decent knife next time".

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pravit
    It pisses her off, in other words.

    There are other expressions using "tits"(most of them British, I've noted).

    "better than a kick in the tits" - really good
    "things have gone tits-up" - things have gone to sh*t

    There are probably some others I've forgotten.
    Hmz, the only other one I can think of is "it pisses the tits off me", which is up there in quality imagery =)
    Tes yeux brillent si fort
    Comme moi quand je suis plein
    Bouff

  12. #52
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    Re: Ленин

    Because the use of 'false facts' to support an otherwise sound argument really pisses the tits off me, I was compelled to write this post.

    Concerning the US Constitution, Mike wrote the following:
    "Any of the amendments can be removed at any time providing they get Congressional approval to do so. Congress could take away every single one of the items on the Bill of Rights if a majority vote decided to. "

    It isn't quite that easy to change the Constitution. There are two ways to do this:
    First Way: two-thirds of the entire US Congress (that is, the House and the Senate) must approve any amendment (and REMOVING an amendment is also an amendment--an example is the amendment that repealed the amendment making alcohol illegal in the US). Then, the amendment must be approved by three-fourths of the states' legislatures. (or, I believe, the number of states which must approve is 34)
    Second Way: This has never been done, but it would require that two-thirds of the states' legislatures petition the Federal Congress to call a convention to discuss and write possible amendments. These too, would also have to subsequently be approved by three-quarters of the states.
    I will say a prayer tonight in which I will fervently thank God that the process of amending the US Constitution is not nearly as easy as Mike wrote.
    If you take home a wounded and starving dog, nurse him back to health, and give him a home, the chances are excellent that, in the future, this dog will not bite you. This is the principal difference between dogs and men.-Paraphrase of Mark Twain

  13. #53
    DDT
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    Well hi again Janice.

    Quote Originally Posted by Janice McNay
    It isn't quite that easy to change the Constitution. There are two ways to do this:
    First Way: two-thirds of the entire US Congress (that is, the House and the Senate) must approve any amendment (and REMOVING an amendment is also an amendment--an example is .
    I agree. I knew this when Mike (and Scotcher) made the reply. I just could not be bothered with the typing. Although I am not American I do realize the value of The Constitution, it is better than what a lot of countries have.

    But, however difficult it is to amend the constitution, the fact that there was an amendment that repealed the amendment making alcohol illegal in the US is a concern or pet peeve of mine. In fact it scares me and it is part of why I did not respond to Mike and Scotcher on this issue.( Because in theory they are right but on the other hand it is easier and more likely to happen in England and Australia than in the US. The banning of firearms in Australia is one example.) Ahem…getting back to Prohibition. How did this ever happen in such a civilized country? Prohibition seems to be a uniquely American phenomenon, amongst supposedly free nations. I mean, to tell people that they can't have a drink is just "weird". Which opens up another can of worms. What about the drinking age in USA? 21? You have to be kidding me. An eighteen year old man can vote, be drafted and convicted as an adult for a crime but he is “not old enough” to go to the corner and buy a beer. Or buy wine with his meal in a restaurant when on a date. If I was under 21. I would be in the streets protesting over this. To hell with protesting against the war in Iraq. First things first. Get your domestic issues in order first and then perhaps you won’t have to protest the foreign policy. Sheesh! Somebody shop me!
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

  14. #54
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    What about the drinking age in USA? 21?
    I thought it's 21 only in some states.

  15. #55
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    It is 21 in all 50 states.
    http://www.mudpc.org/laws.html


    Here is how the reat of the world sees it. USA has the highest drinking age.
    http://www2.potsdam.edu/alcohol-info/Le ... ngAge.html
    Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade where I choose, free to choose my own teachers, free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think and act for myself. - Chief Joseph, Nez Perce

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    Quote Originally Posted by Евгения Белякова
    Svetlana, я is never capitilized like in English. It's always lower cased.
    Never say never:

    Я живу в России
    Это я
    Ingenting kan stoppa mig
    In Post-Soviet Russia internet porn downloads YOU!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pravit
    What about the drinking age in USA? 21?
    I thought it's 21 only in some states.
    It used to be 21 in Minnesota but 18 in Wisconsin, but the Minnesotans got all po'd about people drunk driving over state lines and made us change it. Fascists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dogboy182
    Wait. We are talking about lenin right ? THE lenin ?

    Omfg, he rules.

    He laid the true smack down on those evil tsars. Then, there were these wimpy leftist wimps, and they were like "oh, let the people have a say wah wah" and lenin was like SECRET POLICE! GO! and pimp slapped all them too. Infact, i wish lenin were alive today.

    В небе - ленин!
    lol... amusing...

    )-(@®

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