How did the "k" get into Popkov? Why didn't it just stay Popov?
So would Smirnkov sound weird like Popkov?
Printable View
How did the "k" get into Popkov? Why didn't it just stay Popov?
So would Smirnkov sound weird like Popkov?
Поп (priest) -> ПоповQuote:
Originally Posted by thelaxu
Попок (diminutive-caressing of поп/priest) -> Попков
These are two very different surnames.Quote:
Originally Posted by thelaxu
Вообще-то, скорее "попок".Quote:
Originally Posted by the.mike
Наверное :D спасибо!Quote:
Originally Posted by wanja
Или Попко. )Quote:
Originally Posted by wanja
Why do you think Popkov sounds weird? It doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by thelaxu
Если бы фамилия происходила от слова "попка", то ударение было бы другое - Пóпков. А скорее всего вообще было бы Пóпкин. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by the.mike
Does the same rule now apply to the surnames listed below? I'm just wondering if adding a "к" in the name makes it a corruption (a departure from the original or from what is pure or correct.) Lots of surnames used by Americans are corruptions, I would consider the surname Eisenhower to be a corruption, it should be Eisenhauer.Quote:
Originally Posted by the.mike
Смирнков
Иванков
Кузнецков
Попков
Соколков
Лебедкев
Козлков
Новикков
Морозков
Петрков
Волкков
Соловькёв
Василькев
Зайцкев
Павлков
Семёнков
Голубкев
Виноградков
Богданков
Воробькёв
No.Quote:
Originally Posted by thelaxu
There is no any particular "rule" here. It's just that there is the word поп and there is the word попок. But it doesn't mean that words like смирнок, козлок, новикок, and others exist. They don't. Most of 'surnames' in your list don't exist and many of them are even impossible or very hard to pronounce.
Ok, so most of those "surnames" don't exist.
How about the former Russian mafia member Вячеслав Иваньков?
How did Иванов become Иваньков? Does Иваньков sound weird?
He has never been Иванов in fact. :D Иваньков sounds more or less like Jenkins or Dobkins in English.Quote:
Originally Posted by thelaxu
Look, in fact there are some rules or at least some basis for linguistic theorycrafting. But it is difficult to craft such theories without deep knowledge of Russian linguistics. At least I feel that my knowledge is not enough. :unknown:
It's not a corruption. They are DIFFERENT SURNAMES!!! Really.Quote:
Originally Posted by thelaxu
I checked, and some sources say that Popkov derives from Popko - an obscure FIRST name (or should I say a nickname), that derived from 'pop'. So Popov (presumably) is a priest's son, Popkov is a son of someone, named after a priest. If Popov is made after 'popok' (diminutive from 'pop') after all, they are still different surnames. 'Popok' is more derogatory, so if the priest was not respected they could call him 'popok', and his children would have been Попковы.
If you change Popkov to Popov, it will be a different name, because this is not a spelling 'mistake' or corruption, "k" is there for a reason.
Does it answer your question?
Anyway, why is this obsession with Popkov?
PS. And yes, some of the surnames in your list do not exist or sound unnatural, because they break a common pattern.
Well, Jenkins and Dobkins sounds perfectly normal in English, not weird or funny at all, so I guess Иваньков sounds perfectly normal in Russian, not weird or funny?Quote:
Originally Posted by it-ogo
An addendum to my previous post. :)
You should realise, that letters in Russian surnames do not appear out of the blue, you can't put them in randomly and create a different surname. Often (but not always) 'K' is a trace of the diminutive suffixes (-ик, -чик, -ок, etc). That means that such a surname derives not from the full form of the word, but from its diminutive.
So..
Смирнков - hypothetically possible, but google failed to find anyone with this surname
Иванков - possible (from Иванко (first name))
Кузнецков - sounds really bad, but possible, if derives from Кузнецк (a geographical name). Or it should be Кузнечиков (from Кузнечик)
Попков - possible
Соколков - possible (from соколок)
Лебедкев - IMPOSSIBLE, should be either Лебедков or Лебёдкин (or anything else)
Козлков - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Козликов (from козлик)
Новикков - IMPOSSIBLE and looks like a typo, Новиков can't be changed
Морозков - possible (from морозко)
Петрков - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Петриков
Волкков - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Волчков (from волчок)
Соловькёв - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Соловков or Соловкин or Соловушкин (from соловушка), etc.
Василькев - probably possible (with stress on 'и'), but sounds weird. Васильков is much more natural and common
Зайцкев - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Зайчиков, Зайкин or Зайков
Павлков - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Павликов
Семёнков - possible, but Семенков ('е' instead of 'ё' and different stress) seems more common
Голубкев - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Голубков
Виноградков - possible
Богданков - possible
Воробькёв - IMPOSSIBLE, should be Воробкин, Воробков or even Воробушкин
Now I understand. Thank you.
I disagree here. Both look completely impossible to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by gRomoZeka
Wow! There is my surname here :DQuote:
Originally Posted by gRomoZeka
You are welcome.Quote:
Now I understand. Thank you.
Well, I said 'probably' and 'hypothetically', because weird things do happen. You never know... :D But I agree, that they sound a bit forced.Quote:
Originally Posted by Оля
There are a lot of ways to construct surname in Russia. It may be not only from name of men, but also from the name of a villarge or a town, where this men anytime had lived, for exsample. Or fought there anytime. Иваньков or Попков could born from "Иваньково" and "Попково" оr "Попки".
Морозков could form from Морозко - ancient russian name. I can tell more about history of forming russian surnames, but my english is so foul...
I`m sorry. :tease:
PS: "Виноградков" - impossible, because there wasn`t firstname or sobriquet, or geographical name. May be "Виноградинов", if any women`s sobriquet in this kin was "виноградина" (undersized and plump :upset: ). But unlikely because of its length: sobriquet must be shorter. More it may be "Виноградырев" - from profession. Or "Виноградников" if somebody of kin had a big vineyard, or his mother gave birth to him under the bush of vine. And so on :o
Some villagers say "виноградка" instead of "виноградинка" (a grape). I think it's within the realm of possibility, that Виноградков can stem from this. Moreover, Виноградкин does exist (same roots), so why not Виноградков?Quote:
Originally Posted by enge
I'm not trying to prove that this is a common name or anything (it will be rare for sure), but it's linguistically and historically possible.