Results 1 to 10 of 10
Like Tree4Likes
  • 1 Post By xXHoax
  • 1 Post By xXHoax
  • 1 Post By Soft sign
  • 1 Post By alexsms

Thread: выпить vs пить

  1. #1
    Подающий надежды оратор
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    19
    Rep Power
    1

    выпить vs пить

    The Pimsleur course I have uses пить to mean to drink. In another post here I saw this as выпить. Which is correct?

  2. #2
    Почтенный гражданин xXHoax's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    314
    Rep Power
    19
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0LyvD9lkL8

    Every verb concept comes with a pair of words.
    One of them is Imperfective, the other Perfective

    Пить is the imperfective verb for "to drink"
    Выпить is the perfective verb for "to drink"

    Perfective is used for completed, one time actions.
    Imperfective is used for ongoing, repeated actions.

    Пил = "was drinking", "drank (a bit)", "drank (every day)"
    Выпил = "finished drinking", "drank (the whole thing)"

    About 99.97% of Russian verbs have an Imperfective-Perfective pair

    Most often, one verb will be imperfective, and the perfective will be the same root with an added prefix. по- being the most common
    Here with пить you can see that the prefix вы- is what constitutes the perfective.

    Sometimes an extra in-syllable is added to form imperfective from perfective -ыв-

    https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%B...B0%D1%82%D1%8C


    A common hierarchy structure is:

    ROOT [imperfective] -pair- prefix1-ROOT [perfective]

    prefix2-ROO-infix-T -pair- prefix2-ROOT [perfective]

    prefix3-ROO-infix-T -pair- prefix3-ROOT [perfective]

    prefix4-ROO-infix-T -pair- prefix4-ROOT [perfective]

    The first pair would constitute the most basic meaning. "To hit" for instance. The other pairs would make up more flavoured types, with a new prefix. "To knock off", or "To break up"
    So the most basic imperfective root is then used with prefixes for all the perfective forms, while all the *other* imperfectives use a new slightly altered version of the base root.

    https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%B1%D0%B8%D1%82%D1%8C

    Also, you will notice a vague correlation between Imperfective verbs ending in -ать, and Perfective verbs ending in -ить. This is certainly no rule, it is often not the case, but more often *is* the case.
    Alex80 likes this.
    "В тёмные времена хорошо видно светлых людей."
    - A quote, that only exists in Russian. Erich Maria Remarque

  3. #3
    Почтенный гражданин Soft sign's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    г. Новосибирск
    Posts
    540
    Rep Power
    21
    Quote Originally Posted by xXHoax View Post
    About 99.97% of Russian verbs have an Imperfective-Perfective pair

    Most often, one verb will be imperfective, and the perfective will be the same root with an added prefix. по- being the most common
    Here with пить you can see that the prefix вы- is what constitutes the perfective.

    Sometimes an extra in-syllable is added to form imperfective from perfective -ыв-

    A common hierarchy structure is:
    ROOT [imperfective] -pair- prefix1-ROOT [perfective]
    prefix2-ROO-infix-T -pair- prefix2-ROOT [perfective]
    prefix3-ROO-infix-T -pair- prefix3-ROOT [perfective]
    prefix4-ROO-infix-T -pair- prefix4-ROOT [perfective]
    It’s even more complicated. There is the verb попи́ть, another perfective counterpart of the unprefixed пить.
    Попи́ть means ‘drink some’ while вы́пить is ‘finish drinking’. Although, they are interchangeable in many cases.

    Moreover, the verb вы́пить has its own prefixed imperfective form выпива́ть ‘drink (a certain amount)’.
    E.g. «Я выпива́ю 5 ча́шек ко́фе в день» ‘I drink 5 cups of coffee a day’.

    Another nuance is that the pair выпива́ть—вы́пить often means ‘drink alcohol’, especially without a direct object specified.
    «Он ча́сто выпива́ет» ‘He drinks hard’
    «Хо́чешь пить? — Нет, я хочу́ вы́пить» ‘Are you thirsty?’ ‘No, I wanna booze up’
    Please correct my English

  4. #4
    Почтенный гражданин xXHoax's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    314
    Rep Power
    19
    I think that is why по- is so often used as the perfective-adding prefix - its meaning already is shortness.
    In that sense, попить might be the more natural counterpart, and выпить is merely the more functionally common perfective realization of пить.

    I guess you could say that you start with the base meaning БИТЬ, and it gets fragmented along many axes, one of which is perfectiveness, which itself gets split by prefix-axes, being the different kinds of added conceptualizations. So in some cases there are various aspects of perfectivity stressed in different prefixed-versions of the base, as well as different added meanings altogether stressed.

    I suppose the reason prefixes all make perfectives, is that they each bring to the table the idea of an action вы-out of, у-away, etc. and those actions are inherently whole ideas, such that if you add the whole idea to a root, you get the meaning of the root carried out across a whole concept; and from THERE you have to distinguish that the desired meaning *also* involves duration, so the infix is added.

    *representing an endpoint, a finished verb product

    ROOT* (пить)
    (xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx--------по- instantaneity----perfective--*xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx/xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    (---Simple Perfective branch--xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx------added infix-- repeated completion----*xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx\xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx/xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx
    (xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx----------вы- completion-----perfective--*xxxxxxx----------added infix----------imperfective----*
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx/xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    (-------some prefixed meaning-----------------------------------------------------------perfective----*xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxx
    (xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxx
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxx----------added infix----------imperfective----*xxxxxxxxxxxx
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxx/xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx x
    (-------some prefixed meaning-----------------------------------------------------------perfective----*xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    )xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxx
    (ad nauseum




    For some ROOTs, the perfective branch contains only one descendant, which employs all aspects of perfectivity? I think probably.
    Soft sign likes this.
    "В тёмные времена хорошо видно светлых людей."
    - A quote, that only exists in Russian. Erich Maria Remarque

  5. #5
    Подающий надежды оратор
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    19
    Rep Power
    1
    I'm saying the sentence was the same, it's just this version of Pimsleur uses pit', sorry I can't post Cyrillic now, rather than vuipit'. I want to know if they are the same.

    The version I have says Ya hachu pit'.

    The version mentioned in the thread says Ya hachu vuipit'.

    Actually, from looking at it, it does not. It uses a different form of hachu which this release doesn't have. The ya potel bui vuipit' chto-nibuit' version. Doesn't Pimsleur change things up every so often?

    Is it correct then to say ya hachu pit'? How is ya potel bui vuipit' different, as it's not in the edition I have.

  6. #6
    Подающий надежды оратор
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    19
    Rep Power
    1
    For clarification:

    The lesson mentioned here says: Я потел бы выпить тоже

    This version doesn't have any of that. It simply says Я хочу пить. I want to make sure I'm learning the right thing.

  7. #7
    Почтенный гражданин xXHoax's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    314
    Rep Power
    19
    The difference between perfective and imperfective is constant, and upheld in any and every case.

    Я хочу пить/выпить

    The difference depends on what/how you want to drink; and both a viable translations for "I want to drink"
    Roughly, the difference is like "wanting to spend some time drinking"(progress focus) versus "wanting to have a drink so that you'll have had a drink"(Result focus)

    The выпить meaning alcoholic beverage is for all intents and purposes contextual, and not something to worry about. Just like in English when we say "drink", it can contextually carry alcoholic meaning.

    All in all, it's perfectly okay to move ahead past gritty specifics, and just re encounter them later, from another direction. After all, most everything has to be put into real Russian context in order to be properly understood, i.e. when you see a couple movies where they talk about drinking, your brain will capture and abstract out the important patterns for you
    "В тёмные времена хорошо видно светлых людей."
    - A quote, that only exists in Russian. Erich Maria Remarque

  8. #8
    Почтенный гражданин Soft sign's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    г. Новосибирск
    Posts
    540
    Rep Power
    21
    The phrase «Я хочу выпить» / «Я хотел бы выпить» without a direct object definitely means ‘I want to drink alcohol’ while «Я хочу пить» means ‘I want to drink’ / ‘I’m thirsty’.
    xXHoax likes this.
    Please correct my English

  9. #9
    Властелин
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Russia
    Posts
    1,038
    Rep Power
    20
    Some notes on these 2 words if used in 'drinking alcohol' meaning,

    Выпить can often be used in alcohol related context (used as a single verb). Examples: он вчера выпил (he drank yesterday), он выпил и ему нельзя садиться за руль (he has drunk alcohol and mustn't be driving), он сильно выпил (he drank a lot of alcohol), etc. - here it implies the fact of drinking, or instance(s) of it.

    At the same time пить can also be used in this sense and it can sometimes mean a medical condition or a longer process. Examples: он пьет (he is a chronic drinker), он пил всю неделю (he was drinking the whole week), cf. он выпивает - means 'he drinks alcohol occasionally'

    In neutral contexts (no acohol is implied) it seems that they work as usual verbs: пить is imperfect, выпить suggests the perfect tense (has/have drunk), they don't look different from regular verbs here.
    Soft sign likes this.

  10. #10
    Moderator Lampada's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    СССР -> США
    Posts
    17,552
    Rep Power
    31
    По теме.




    Считай по-нашему, мы выпили немного,
    Не вру, ей-Богу, скажи, Серега!
    И если б водку гнать не из опилок,
    То что б нам было с пяти бутылок.

    Вторую пили близ прилавка в закуточке,
    Но это были ещё цветочки,
    Потом в скверу, где детские грибочки,
    Потом... не помню, дошел до точки.

    Еще б, я пил из горлышка с устатку и не емши,
    Но я, как стекло был, то есть, остекленевший.
    Ну, а когда коляска подкатила,
    Тогда в нас было семьсот на рыло.

    Мы, правда, третьего насильно затащили,
    Но тут промашка - переборщили.
    А что очки товарищу разбили,
    Так то портвейном усугубили.

    Товарищ первый нам сказал, что, мол, уймитесь,
    Что не буяньте, что разойдитесь.
    Ну на "разойтись" я сразу согласился -
    И разошёлся, и расходился.

    Но если я кого ругал, карайте строго,
    Но это вряд ли, скажи, Серега!
    А что упал - так то от помутненья,
    Орал не с горя, от отупенья.

    Теперь позвольте пару слов без протокола.
    Чему нас учит семья и школа?
    Что жизнь сама таких накажет строго, (правильно?)
    Тут мы согласны, скажи, Серега!

    Вот он проснётся и, конечно, скажет,
    Пусть жизнь осудит, пусть жизнь накажет.
    Так отпустите, вам же легче будет.
    Ну, что вам возиться, раз жизнь осудит.

    Вы не глядите, что Сережа всё кивает.
    Он соображает, всё понимает,
    А что молчит, так это от волненья,
    От осознанья и просветленья.

    Не запирайте, люди, плачут дома детки,
    Ему же в Химки, а мне в Медведки...
    А, всё равно: автобусы не ходят,
    Метро закрыто, в такси не содют.

    Приятно всё ж таки, что нас тут уважают,
    Гляди, подвозят, Серега, гляди, сажают.
    Разбудит утром не петух, прокукарекав,
    Сержант поднимет, как человеков.

    Нас чуть не с музыкой проводят, как проспимся.
    Я рубль заначил, слышь, Сергей, давай опохмелимся.
    И всё же, брат, трудна у нас дорога!
    Эх, бедолага, ну спи, Серега.

Similar Threads

  1. пить чай из блюдца
    By sperk in forum Society
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: February 18th, 2010, 12:47 PM
  2. пить из чайника
    By sperk in forum Society
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: February 16th, 2010, 10:00 PM
  3. и пить дать
    By Siriusly in forum Translate This!
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: November 11th, 2006, 01:46 PM
  4. Пить как рыба
    By Бармалей in forum Grammar and Vocabulary
    Replies: 55
    Last Post: March 31st, 2006, 05:44 PM
  5. Пить пить !
    By Dogboy182 in forum Fun Stuff
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: May 20th, 2003, 09:50 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Russian Lessons                           

Russian Tests and Quizzes            

Russian Vocabulary