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So if I (female) say this sentence I need to say "стала" right?Quote:
"Я стал медленно взбираться на холм".
But no other changes... ?
Darn these male-chauvinistic :angel: text books that assume all the readers are men!
How cute that the word "холм" exists in Swedish and means more or less the same thing..! It's very rare for Swedish with Russian borrowed words, but there are some and I guess this is one of them... Maybe some Viking heard it and thought it was useful...
In Russian we always write the full stop after the quotation mark.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
No, no other changes. )
Thanks!
:oops: You know, it's probably like that (full-stop outside quotation marks) in ALL languages... I have forgotten many such rules...
Except for English apparently. In English you put a full-stop before the closing quotation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
If there is just a sentence in quotation marks with no part of the complete sentence outside, the full stop goes inside the quotation marks, too.
"There is a full stop inside the quote."
He said: "There is a full stop outside the quote".
Robin
Or vice versa.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
I found some list of Russian words borrowed from Scandinavia and try to translate it to Swedish:
сельдь - sill (Sild in Danish)
ларь - lår
пуд - ?(Pud in Deutsch)
крюк - krok
якорь - ankar (akkeri in Icelandic)
ябеда - ämbete (old Scandinavian embaehti); meaning of the word is significantly changed in Russian
плис - pliss? (old plys?)
кнут - knut (old Scandinavian knútr, old Swedish knute) meaning of the word is slightly changed in Russian
мачта - mast
I foundQuote:
How cute that the word "холм" exists in Swedish and means more or less the same thing..!
Холм - höjd, backe, kulle, berg
I think höjd is not looks like холм.
I had to look that one up and I am German. A word for 16 kilos? Funny. But there's a German Wikipedia article which lists this as an old Russian measure of weight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowik
Robin
I found it!
soQuote:
ПУД — Др.-рус. Заимств. из др.-сканд. яз., где pund "фунт", восходит через англосаксонского pund к лат. pondus "вес, тяжесть", производного (с перегласовкой в корне) от pendo "вешаю"....
пуд - pund. Мeaning of the word is 40 times large in Russian :-)
There is a word 'Pfund' which refers to different weight measurements depending on what time and place you're looking at, these days it is half a kilogram. 'Pund' is dialectal at best.
Robin
Nice finds! I've seen some other ones too... The one I can remember at the top of my head is СТУЛ = STOL (pronounced the same...)Quote:
сельдь - sill (Sild in Danish)
ларь - lår
пуд - ?(Pud in Deutsch)
крюк - krok - Nice one
якорь - ankarE (akkeri in Icelandic)
ябеда - ämbete (old Scandinavian embaehti); meaning of the word is significantly changed in Russian
плис - pliss? (old plys?) It's a tool, I think.. Not sure...
кнут - knut (old Scandinavian knútr, old Swedish knute) meaning of the word is slightly changed in Russian - Yes, nice!
мачта - mast Yes, but I think it's the same in most North European languages.
The word that I was thinking of was not "höjd" but "holm". It's an old word that means "height" or a cone-shaped island. It's quite common in surnames and names of towns.
Swedish has TONS of words that came from German at some point or another. It seems that Russian has quite a lot such words too - But they stand out more in Russian, since it's not a "Germanic" langauge.
The word "soldat" I think is the same in German, Swedish and Russian. Probably lots of other military words too.
The words that exist in Russian and Swedish but not in German are more historically interesting... It means that they came with Russian travellers to Sweden, or were via the Vikings.
The Swedish Vikings tended to go East more than the Norwegian and Danish vikings did. They travelled to Konstantinopel on the rivers of Russia/Ukraine. But they stopped and settled places on the way.
Also - people from Russia travelled to Sweden / Finland and worked in trade.... There are often Russian traders in old Scandinavian litterature. People percieved these Russian traders as a bit "mystical". I guess it's possible that such people brought words with them that were picked up..
As far as I remember this word is Italian originally. It was used for mercenaries and originates from soldo - Italian coin. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
Don't you know that the first royal family of Rus was from Scandinavia? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rurik Actually they are founders of the very state of Kievan Rus. They brought some names which are now common in Russia: Oleg, Olga (Hélgi, Hélga), Igor (Ingvarr)...Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
Yes I had heard of Rurik, but not a lot... I am impressed at your knowledge! I just knew that the Vikings founded some cities along the rivers that they travelled on - it was covered in History in school. Novgorod was one of the cities that they founded.
I read the Wikipedia article about Rurik and it was interesting to hear that the DNA tests of his descendents showed that his origins were in Roslagen, an area North of Stockholm.
I went to boarding school quite close to there and the area has LOTS of old rune-stones (stones that the vikings left messages on). Most of the stones were about trips that the writer or his family members had been on - often going East.
:friends: It's nice that the Vikings were actually appreciated somewhere (ie Ukraine/Russia). Most countries hated them!
http://www.trosasund.se/foto/runsten.jpg
My knowledge? :crazy: Look, it is the start of our history! Everybody learn it at school just after the alphabet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
The legend says that they were especially invited as neutral and powerful warriors and rulers to unite the scattered people. :flazhok:Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
Vikings were just hired as military experts to rule armed forces of Slavic.Quote:
Originally Posted by it-ogo
Gradually the power of highest military commanders (Князь) increased and they became civil governors also.
So the role of the protoparliament (Вече) was decreased.
The name Russia, Rus' also is derived from a name of some hipotetical Vikings tribe Rus'.
Possible the name of people of Vikings troops was spread onto non-Vikings people also.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normanist_ ... ist_theory
Quote:
Main Entry: holm
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English, from Old Norse hōlmr;
Date: before 12th century
British : a small inland or inshore island;
So ХОЛМ, HOLM/HOLME is not borrowed word. It is common word for Germanic and Slavic languages.Quote:
ХОЛМ. Общеславянское. Обычно толкуют как древнее заимств. из герм. яз. (ср. др.-сакс. holm "высота, холм"), однако, скорее всего, слово является общеславяногерманским праевропейской эпохи.
It was always and everywhere ;-)
Quote:
Ох, у ямы стоит холм с кулями, выйду на́ холм, куль поправлю!
Long time back I heard that "Rus" meant something like the "land of rivers" in slavic. Compare with the word "русалка" (rusalka) meaning fish-woman who lived at the bottom of rivers. :unknown:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowik
Русалка, русалиа is from Greek.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crocodile
Quote:
РУСАЛКА. Искон. Суф. производное от др.-рус. русалия, заимств. из ст.-сл. яз., где оно восходит к ср.-греч. rousalia "праздник Троицы" < лат. rosalia - тж. (исходно - "праздник роз"), суф. образования от rosa (см. роза).
Interesting... And what relationship do rusalkas have with rosalia? Do they celebrate it in any way known?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowik
Here is what I heard:Quote:
Originally Posted by Crocodile
The Vikings thought that the language in the area sounded like this:
So the Vikings nicknamed it "Ryss-Land"Quote:
Originally Posted by Ancient Russians and Ukrainians
-> Ryssland (Scandinavia) -> Russland (in German) and Russia in English. Then Romans/Latin picked up the name and it was spread everywhere.
I don't know if this is true though, but the story was mentioned in school.
The Vikings also sometimes called Russia/Ukraine "Gårdarike" (Land of farm houses) They were impressed by the fertile soil. The old runestones makes it clear that the Vikings had a high opinion of the people in this area.
Gård (gord) means farm or trading place. I guess it's possible that there is a link with the Russian word "город"
That's all I know about it...
Do not forget, Slavic руслака is not fish-women (mermaid). It's like a water nymph, ghostly lass, which live in water and has a dangerous hypnotic power. Especially she is dangerous for men, because she is дьявольски beautifull.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crocodile
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...px-Rusalki.jpg
The Rusalka sounds very cool... :angel:
I had never heard of it.
Hah! They are wrong. Sweden is full of places with the word -holm, meaning hill. Basically it means something sticking up from the ground ("toppy") and it doesnät matter if it is on land or in a lake. Proved by the fact that the places in question are not islands but hills, and are not even near any lake.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowik
PLUS the word is used in old songs with the meaning "hill".
This source is incomplete.
It is English Etymology Dictionary.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johanna
My "Concise Oxford Dictionary of English Etymology" says that 'holm(e)' was used in English meaning 'islet' in the 11th century and 'low-lying land by a river' in the 13th. As related words it gives 'holmr' from Old Norse meaning 'islet' or 'meadow by the shore', Old English 'holm' for billow, wave, sea (in poetic context), and Old Swedish 'holm' for 'hill'.
Robin