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Thread: разве vs. неужели

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    Почтенный гражданин BabaYaga's Avatar
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    разве vs. неужели

    I sort of know the difference between разве and неужели - but only sort of....

    Would anyone care to elaborate a bit? Or maybe give some examples in which you can definitely only use one or the other?
    I'm having a hard time "feeling" these two....

    Заранее спасибо
    Ой, голова у меня кружится |-P ...... and my brain hurts too....

  2. #2
    Властелин
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    Неужели sounds to me a bit ironical.

    "Вчера мы наконец-то порвали ту команду!"
    "Неужели?" (сарказм)
    -- Да? Коту Ваське, бл##?
    -- Нет, Я кот Васька :-/

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent Tailors
    "Неужели?" (сарказм)
    Далеко не всегда.
    In Russian, all nationalities and their corresponding languages start with a lower-case letter.

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    Завсегдатай Basil77's Avatar
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    For example:

    "Разве можно обижать маленьких?" - reprimand
    "Неужели можно обижать маленьких?" - surprise, consternation

    Feel the difference?
    Please, correct my mistakes, except for the cases I misspell something on purpose!

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    "Разве он там был" and "Неужели он там был" are similar in that they both indicate the speaker doesn't know/think that the guy in question was there.
    "Неужели", however, communicates a stronger surprise and/or disbeliefe than "разве".

    "Разве он там был" communicates something lke "Oh, so he was there? I thought he wasn't?"

    "Неужели он там был" is something like "Oh, he was there? I didn't even think it was possible!"

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    Властелин charlestonian's Avatar
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    разве vs. неужели

    From http://www.multitran.ru/

    разве conj. phrases | g-sort gener.really (выражает интерес, удивление, сомнение и т. п.); perhaps; only (is it the only reason? - разве это единственная причина?); unless math.if разве? conj. to start gener.is that so?

    неужели prepos. phrases | g-sort gener.really; is it possible; indeed (выражает удивление, иронию, сомнение); can it be true (вопрос) colloq.coo (выражает удивление, недоверие, сомнение) jarg.you don't say
    Well, I don't know what to say. I want to say thanks to the Academy, to Mama, to Papa and to my dog. I love you all.

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    Почтенный гражданин BabaYaga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by charlestonian
    разве vs. неужели

    From http://www.multitran.ru/

    разве conj. phrases | g-sort gener.really (выражает интерес, удивление, сомнение и т. п.); perhaps; only (is it the only reason? - разве это единственная причина?); unless math.if разве? conj. to start gener.is that so?

    неужели prepos. phrases | g-sort gener.really; is it possible; indeed (выражает удивление, иронию, сомнение); can it be true (вопрос) colloq.coo (выражает удивление, недоверие, сомнение) jarg.you don't say
    Well, all the above is actually my problem....
    My book says more or less the same thing: there's a positive (неужели)/negative (разве) connotation, but once they start translating them by "really?!", "is that so?!" and "you don't say?!", "indeed?!" - I'm lost again, because in English, all four of these can be both reprimanding, stunned, happily surprised, or negatively loaded, all depending on the tone of voice.....

    Argh.

    But thanks guys , for all the examples, I'll try to battle my way through it for a while, and get back to you if I still don't get it....
    Ой, голова у меня кружится |-P ...... and my brain hurts too....

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    Старший оракул
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    when разве is said, normally a negative/contradictory response is expected. ie
    вот скажи мне, американец, в чем сила? разве в деньгах?
    ie, you REALLY think just money?
    (olga, please be gentle with my grammar :P )
    Не откладывай на завтра того, с кем можешь переспать сегодня
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    Завсегдатай Basil77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lt. Columbo
    when разве is said, normally a negative/contradictory response is expected. ie
    вот скажи мне, американец, в чем сила? разве в деньгах?
    ie, you REALLY think just money?
    (olga, please be gentle with my grammar :P )
    Lt. Columbo, in this particular case "разве" can be replaced with "неужели" without any change of meaning.

    P.S. Like "Брат-2", yea?
    Please, correct my mistakes, except for the cases I misspell something on purpose!

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    Не откладывай на завтра того, с кем можешь переспать сегодня
    --------
    http://england-moscow.com/

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    Почтенный гражданин BabaYaga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Basil77
    Lt. Columbo, in this particular case "разве" can be replaced with "неужели" without any change of meaning.
    ........ see what I mean?


    Don't worry, I'll get it. Some time.
    Ой, голова у меня кружится |-P ...... and my brain hurts too....

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    Re: разве vs. неужели

    Quote Originally Posted by BabaYaga
    Or maybe give some examples in which you can definitely only use one or the other?
    Let's make it a test for a change.
    Your team is losing a match, again. You can express your anxiety saying
    "..... мы опять проиграем?"
    And you may say about your team performance
    "..... это игра? Это позорище!"
    or
    "..... ЭТО они называют игрой? Это позорище!"

  13. #13
    Властелин charlestonian's Avatar
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    I think you can use неужели as a single word (it can make a short phrase by itself) but not разве...

    For example:

    Разве так говорят? Неужели?

    (you would not just say Разве?).
    Well, I don't know what to say. I want to say thanks to the Academy, to Mama, to Papa and to my dog. I love you all.

  14. #14
    Властелин charlestonian's Avatar
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    Re: разве vs. неужели

    Quote Originally Posted by E-learner
    Quote Originally Posted by BabaYaga
    Or maybe give some examples in which you can definitely only use one or the other?
    Let's make it a test for a change.
    Your team is losing a match, again. You can express your anxiety saying
    "Неужели мы опять проиграем?"
    And you may say about your team performance
    "Разве это игра? Это позорище!"
    or
    "Разве ЭТО они называют игрой? Это позорище!"

    Good example

    PS. In the last sentence, you can also use Неужели, methink...
    Well, I don't know what to say. I want to say thanks to the Academy, to Mama, to Papa and to my dog. I love you all.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by charlestonian
    you would not just say Разве?
    Yes, you can.

    - Он по субботам не работает.
    - Разве?


    P.S. I think this test was not for russian native speakers.
    In Russian, all nationalities and their corresponding languages start with a lower-case letter.

  16. #16
    Властелин charlestonian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Оля
    Quote Originally Posted by charlestonian
    you would not just say Разве?
    Yes, you can.

    - Он по субботам не работает.
    - Разве?


    P.S. I think this test was not for russian native speakers.
    Разве does not sound right, by itself...
    Well, I don't know what to say. I want to say thanks to the Academy, to Mama, to Papa and to my dog. I love you all.

  17. #17
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    "Разве?" sounds absolutely right.
    In Russian, all nationalities and their corresponding languages start with a lower-case letter.

  18. #18
    Властелин charlestonian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Оля
    "Разве?" sounds absolutely right.
    Whatever...
    Well, I don't know what to say. I want to say thanks to the Academy, to Mama, to Papa and to my dog. I love you all.

  19. #19
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    In Russian, all nationalities and their corresponding languages start with a lower-case letter.

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    Re: разве vs. неужели

    Quote Originally Posted by charlestonian
    Quote Originally Posted by E-learner
    Let's make it a test for a change.
    Your team is losing a match, again. You can express your anxiety saying
    "Неужели мы опять проиграем?"
    And you may say about your team performance
    "Разве это игра? Это позорище!"
    or
    "Разве ЭТО они называют игрой? Это позорище!"

    Good example

    PS. In the last sentence, you can also use Неужели, methink...
    Actually, I meant "неужели" to be the only right answer for the last sentence.
    "Неужели ЭТО они называют игрой? ..."

    Is there anyone else who disagree with me?

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