Thread: belarus and the ukraine

my first question is how many people from these two countries speak fluently russian. is it still like 100 percent and what do you think it will be in fifty years? are both countries totally bilingual and will they remain the same?

i heard that a fair amount of ukrainians don't really speak ukrainian (in galicia if i remember correctly) but only russian. is that right? what about kyiv?
i know a group of people from the ukraine here in paris and i swear they speak russian together, not ukrainian. they know the language, of course, but they told me they never use ukrainian within the family or friends circle. for them, it is only an administrative language.

a lot of russian people are saying that bielorussian is russian with an accent and ukrainian is russian with grammatical mistakes (the second part being more of a bad joke). i heard that quite a few times when i was in russia. what do you all think (i'm asking that to people from the three countries)?


ps: i'd love to visit the ukraine and belarus but i need a fucking visa for each country. aaarrgggghhhh. visas are so expensive and only odnokratnie!

I was adopted from Ukraine when I was age 4. Russian was my first language at the orphanage(I lived there since I was 1). I believe they spoke both to us. I think more Russian though. Ukrainian is more widely spoken in Western Ukraine, it is more ethnic there. In my city, Odessa we use Russian.

My mom and my grandmother are from Belarus...their main language was always russian, but I think they know a tiny bit of belorussian too...I have aunts and counsins that live there now and in school I think they now have to take belorussian as a language...so I guess they're encouraging the language more...Plus I think there's also a difference in where the person is from, for example many people in small villages speak belorussian or a combination of that language and russian, but people in bigger cities speak mostly russian...

Originally Posted by possopo

i heard that a fair amount of ukrainians don't really speak ukrainian (in galicia if i remember correctly) but only russian. is that right? what about kyiv?

Galicia(where my ancestry comes from) is largely where Ukrainian is spoken most.

Bandera wrote:

possopo wrote:

i heard that a fair amount of ukrainians don't really speak ukrainian (in galicia if i remember correctly) but only russian. is that right? what about kyiv?


Galicia(where my ancestry comes from) is largely where Ukrainian is spoken most.

yep, i was all wrong on this one

That's not so easy. First, besides "pure" literary languages there are lots of dialects.

For example, the essential part of Ukraine speaks "суржик" ("surzhik") -- some mixture between russian and ukrainian.

Also, as I know, in Belorussia there is "трасянка" (trasyanka), dialect consisting of belorussian, russian, polish and, probably, even some other languages. I don't know how widespread it is.

let's make it very simple:

do you, ukrainians and bielorussians, think of yourselves as a nation (maybe some of you think you're just russians with a weird passport, some are just happy not to be governed by putin -well, kushma may be not better and lukashenko is evil...).

I am Ukrainian, and I do not call myself Russian. Sometimes I do. I have two good friends from Moldova and Kazakhstan and we all are Russian speaking, and sometimes we just say we're Russian. But I do consdier myself Ukrainian, and I think of my country as a nation.

Originally Posted by possopo

let's make it very simple:

do you, ukrainians and bielorussians, think of yourselves as a nation (maybe some of you think you're just russians with a weird passport, some are just happy not to be governed by putin -well, kushma may be not better and lukashenko is evil...).

Yes I consider Ukraine a nation. Belarussian is a nation too, but I'll let them decide their own fate. We may belong to the same "civilizational bloc"(to use Samuel Hunnington's terminology) as Russia, but Ukraine has a distinct culture of its own and has been far more open to Western influences then Russia was. Ukraine was always somewhat a sythesis between the West and the Byzantine traditions of the East.

very interesting because i know quite a lot of people didn't care about nations in the soviet times.
i read a book thats sais that shevarnadze position in the eighties (foreign affairs minister) was one the reasons of the collapse of the usse (him being georgian and not russian). when i got to russia, everyone told me that nobody cared about the citizenship back then, he was just a soviet. that was even the case for stalin or beryia despite their strong accents.

Originally Posted by possopo

very interesting because i know quite a lot of people didn't care about nations in the soviet times.

Even if true, thats probably because people couldnt do much too effect the situation. Stalin was the leader, whether he was Georgian or not.

However, nationalism was quite strong among many of the peoples in the USSR; in fact I've been reading about many of the Ukrainian movements in particular.

Originally Posted by Евгения Белякова

I am Ukrainian, and I do not call myself Russian. Sometimes I do.

Just like Canadians, eh. When it suits them they are North Americans (which is technically correct but they say it to suggest ties with the US), the next they're foaming at the mouth trying to emphasize that they have nothing to do with their southern neigbours. Decide, girl - are you with us or against us?

lol, well I say I am Russian.

I say that i am from Belarus always, however for the some stupid people at my School russian. My best friend (Fidan') is Azerbaijan and always says that she is Russian. It just depends in the person i think.

Yes Pasha, I completely agree it does.

Originally Posted by Pasha

I say that i am from Belarus always, however for the some stupid people at my School russian. My best friend (Fidan') is Azerbaijan and always says that she is Russian. It just depends in the person i think.

You mean in America? Yes I know how it is, Im always having to explain Im not of Russian decent but Ukrainian. Americans lack much sense of geography.

Agreed. Most Americans think that Thai refers to Taiwan.

I've read through these posts, but still am unsure; are Belorussian, Ukranian and Russian all mutually intelligible.Can a Ukrainian speak his language to a Belorussian and still be understood?If a Moscovite goes to Ukraine or Belorus and hears them speaking native tongue, can the Moscovite comprehend?
On a side note; It's funny that Belorussia is named that.Because if 'belo/russia' does mean 'beautiful/russia', that kind of implies that Russia is UNbeautiful. What is the deal with the 'belo' part.Does it actually mean 'beautiful'? Or are all these names just bastardized English translations.I think the German word for 'Russian' means 'stupid' (at least in an older dialect).Unless its the other way around? At some stage anyway, one of these languages was insulting the other race.

The 'belle' / 'bela' etc. root meaning beautiful is in the Romance languages (French, Spanish, Italian etc.). In Russian 'byeliy' means white, and so Belarus is 'White Russia'. I believe the origin of this name is slighltly controversial.
Beautiful in Russia is 'krasiviy' (amongst other things).

As to German/Russian/stupid, yes, I think it is the other way round - nemetz/nemtzi meaning, I think, 'mute/dumb' rather than stupid exactly. Because they (German immigrants in Russia) couldn't speak (Russian). Well, something like that.

As to German/Russian/stupid, yes, I think it is the other way round - nemetz/nemtzi meaning, I think, 'mute/dumb' rather than stupid exactly. Because they (German immigrants in Russia) couldn't speak (Russian). Well, something like that.

Correct. And you're also correct in saying that it's 'mute', not 'stupid'.