Thread: Anyone proud to have been a SOVIET?

I disagree. It has nothing to do with background, it has to do with mindset and personality. It it is perfectly feasible in principle for a Westerner to understand the majority Russian belief that life in the USSR was better than life in Russia is today. It's just unlikely, given the majority mindset of Westerners.

Originally Posted by VendingMachine

For crying out loud, them's frigging sects! The gov't wouldn't register them because it has a duty to protect its citizens. And in my book sects are criminal organizations. But I suppose that's persecution...

Well now, and who is to say that Russian Orthodox is not a sect also?
I would be willing to bet my last set of horse shoes, that even as I write, the Pope is plotting how to bring this rebellious sect of Orthodoxy back into the confines of his fold.
.......Oh my god! I think I have just united VM and JB.

Originally Posted by 2CREATV

My girlfreinds comments that as a child she grew up being afraid of the United States and Americans. She claims that she was 'taught' that people here were evil, uneducated, lazy, drug-users, with a government hell-bent on taking-over the world.[/img]

Which part of this is not true?


just...curious

Originally Posted by Mordan

Originally Posted by TATY

We were fed alot of propoganda here in the West. Even now regarding the Ukrainian elections we were too. But so were the Soviets and now the Russians.

That's why, during the recent Ukrainian elections I read both British and Russian press, and you see that both sides were as bad as eachother really.

And what about the opinion of real young ukrainians????? I have a girl-friend who is from Livl and for her Poutine is a dictator and Kushma was corrupted to the core.

we were not fed propaganda in the west. The events were reported as they happened! No photo was tricked for removing someone on it! We don't have phantoms in our closet.... Our system is imperfect, but far more perfect than the post-communist/post dictatorial system of the USSR.

L'viv is the the Ukrainian heartland though. Go to Donets'k and you'll hear a different story.

Originally Posted by Mordan

Originally Posted by TATY

We were fed alot of propoganda here in the West. Even now regarding the Ukrainian elections we were too. But so were the Soviets and now the Russians.

That's why, during the recent Ukrainian elections I read both British and Russian press, and you see that both sides were as bad as eachother really.

And what about the opinion of real young ukrainians????? I have a girl-friend who is from Livl and for her Poutine is a dictator and Kushma was corrupted to the core.

we were not fed propaganda in the west. The events were reported as they happened! No photo was tricked for removing someone on it! We don't have phantoms in our closet.... Our system is imperfect, but far more perfect than the post-communist/post dictatorial system of the USSR.

It's what is shown and what isn't shown which is the point. We were repeatedly told the first election was fraudulent and that Russia was heavily involved in swinging it for Yanukovych. The fact that for the second election the US poured money into, was hardly mentioned.

Originally Posted by TATY

It's what is shown and what isn't shown which is the point. We were repeatedly told the first election was fraudulent and that Russia was heavily involved in swinging it for Yanukovych. The fact that for the second election the US poured money into, was hardly mentioned.

Yes, I'll agree, media bias is a big force in our world. Hearing differing stories, however, doesn't mean that one has to believe all sides of an issue equally. Sometimes one source's interpretation is just a better fit of the evidence than others.

Originally Posted by Geoduck

Originally Posted by TATY

It's what is shown and what isn't shown which is the point. We were repeatedly told the first election was fraudulent and that Russia was heavily involved in swinging it for Yanukovych. The fact that for the second election the US poured money into, was hardly mentioned.

Yes, I'll agree, media bias is a big force in our world. Hearing differing stories, however, doesn't mean that one has to believe all sides of an issue equally. Sometimes one source's interpretation is just a better fit of the evidence than others.

Yes.

Although, our media in the UK on TV does try and show the other side of the story.

I was watching a report about Latvia and it featured both sides of the story, how the Soviets liberated Latvia from the Nazis and industrialised the country, but also how they occupied it.

Originally Posted by DDT

Well now, and who is to say that Russian Orthodox is not a sect also?

We the Russian people are to say that. We the Russian people, wyth one agreable consent do crye: the Russian Orthodox Church is not a sect. Because the Russian Orthodox Church does not sign contracts with the sick and the elderly to look after them in exchange for their property like the aforementioned sects do. It has been observed that once such contracts have been signed, the old dears, having been in perfect health prior to the signing, all of a sudden run down the curtain and join the bleeding choir invisible.

Anyway, the Orthodox Church really gets on my tits as much as most other churches do.

Originally Posted by scotcher

I disagree. It has nothing to do with background, it has to do with mindset and personality. It it is perfectly feasible in principle for a Westerner to understand the majority Russian belief that life in the USSR was better than life in Russia is today. It's just unlikely, given the majority mindset of Westerners.

Splendid. At last we seem to agree that the majority* mindset of Russians is different from the majority* mindset of Westerners. You may also want to remember that what we do in Russia is our own business. We are not trying to force our way of life or values onto you and we would greatly appreciate it if you did the same thing. We respect your people's choices of gov'ts, values, etc. and we believe you when you say that they are OK ... for you. We do this out of politeness and general understanding that you Western nations should know better what suits your mindset, tradition, etc. Do I make myself clear?

P.S. Of course, one can always find many people who disagree with the view of the majority (in fact, yours truly is one such person).

Originally Posted by VendingMachine

Originally Posted by scotcher

I disagree. It has nothing to do with background, it has to do with mindset and personality. It it is perfectly feasible in principle for a Westerner to understand the majority Russian belief that life in the USSR was better than life in Russia is today. It's just unlikely, given the majority mindset of Westerners.

Splendid. At last we seem to agree that the majority* mindset of Russians is different from the majority* mindset of Westerners. You may also want to remember that what we do in Russia is our own business. We are not trying to force our way of life or values onto you and we would greatly appreciate it if you did the same thing. We respect your people's choices of gov'ts, values, etc. and we believe you when you say that they are OK ... for you. We do this out of politeness and general understanding that you Western nations should know better what suits your mindset, tradition, etc. Do I make myself clear?

P.S. Of course, one can always find many people who disagree with the view of the majority (in fact, yours truly is one such person).

Yes this is what I don't like about America. It's like so happy with it's precious democracey that showing it off to the rest of the world isn't enough, and they have to impose it on other nations. And Russia is democratic anyway, maybe not as much as other countries but still.

Oh please, TATY, don't bash America. Why do you people like to bash them so much? Is it some sort of inferiority complex you have? Must you always say bad things about them? You know, even I feel sick sometimes. You can't be so mean to them. It's just not fair to the average american. Mostly they act in good faith, so I've witnessed. Whatever you say, evil dictatorships must go, no matter what. People do not choose dictatorships, they are forced onto them. When a country exports democracy to another country (and that's what it is, for democracy is a product and therefore it can be exported), it acts like a surgeon who, although he actually hurts the patient with his scalpel during the operation, rids him of a tumour and saves his life. Zat not so, Mordan?

Originally Posted by scotcher

It it is perfectly feasible in principle for a Westerner to understand the majority Russian belief that life in the USSR was better than life in Russia is today. It's just unlikely, given the majority mindset of Westerners.

It IS unlikely, because to even own an opinion separate or different from the norm is met with great punishments and opposition. Free speech is a trap for the masochist. There was a new dog in town. It was smarter than us. It was brilliant, beautiful, enculturated. And personally, I thought it was quite friendly, private, and in individual existance by it's own rules--ferking bitchen stuff man--it was nice to see some intelligence around here. But, damn, for all this truth the most bizarre thing was happening as I watched on as a child in American 80's. My own country was gossiping like a bit*ch and brewing up rumors to put everyone in panic-like a girl who wants her girlfriends guy and will tell her that he is sleeping around so she will dump him. Propaganda. Is this the word? And even if Russia (or whatever she/he was called back then) was trying to dominate the world by first being superior in "everything"-would that have been so bad? I mean shit. YOU taught US about space.

Originally Posted by VendingMachine

Oh please, TATY, don't bash America. Why do you people like to bash them so much? Is it some sort of inferiority complex you have? Must you always say bad things about them? You know, even I feel sick sometimes. You can't be so mean to them. It's just not fair to the average american. Mostly they act in good faith, so I've witnessed. Whatever you say, evil dictatorships must go, no matter what. People do not choose dictatorships, they are forced onto them. When a country exports democracy to another country (and that's what it is, for democracy is a product and therefore it can be exported), it acts like a surgeon who, although he actually hurts the patient with his scalpel during the operation, rids him of a tumour and saves his life. Zat not so, Mordan?

And they get an infection and die. Or the tumour comes back.

I'm sad to see the soviet gone. I do not want another america floating about. I think it's tedious stuff really. I do not want to go over there to visit and see mcdonalds or denny's or worse the english language written all over everything. And when I hear the word democracy... that's all I think about. But I know it won't happen. I really do. Russians will be pissed enough at the mere thought to never let that happen--I do hope.

Originally Posted by TATY

And they get an infection and die. Or the tumour comes back.

You're too pessimistic, TATY. One can't live with this kind of attitude.

Originally Posted by VendingMachine

Oh please, TATY, don't bash America. Why do you people like to bash them so much? Is it some sort of inferiority complex you have? Must you always say bad things about them? You know, even I feel sick sometimes. You can't be so mean to them. It's just not fair to the average american. Mostly they act in good faith, so I've witnessed. Whatever you say, evil dictatorships must go, no matter what. People do not choose dictatorships, they are forced onto them. When a country exports democracy to another country (and that's what it is, for democracy is a product and therefore it can be exported), it acts like a surgeon who, although he actually hurts the patient with his scalpel during the operation, rids him of a tumour and saves his life. Zat not so, Mordan?

Shouldn't a surgeon get a written consent from the patient before starting the operation?

Originally Posted by pisces

Shouldn't a surgeon get a written consent from the patient before starting the operation?

Not when the doctor has decided that the patient in insane.

Originally Posted by DDT

Originally Posted by pisces

Shouldn't a surgeon get a written consent from the patient before starting the operation?

Not when the doctor has decided that the patient in insane.

Is it a surgeon's work to determine the mental state of the patient?

No. A medical board run by the state does that.

Shouldn't a surgeon get a written consent from the patient before starting the operation?

In urgent cases it is not required.