Thread: All Hallows Eve - is that better?

kalinka-vinnie, you're right Halloween isn't a Christian holiday. The Christian holiday is All Hallows Eve. The word Halloween itself is a shortened form of "All Hallows Eve," the day before All Saints Day.

Take a gander at this, straight from the horse's mouth, as it were:
http://www.americancatholic.org/Feature ... efault.asp

My wife is more up on these things than I am, so I asked her. She said that this is a pagan celebration of the new year, which occurred now, not at the end of December. Between the old year and the new year was a between time, between two years, when the spirits could come forth.

I'm in agreement with chaika's wife-but too with the bitchen story of the russian folk holiday. It is currently celebrated as the pagan new year-here in the states.

"Samhain Lore" (pronounced sowe-en)-from Scott Cunningham's Guide to the Solitary Practioner.

It is traditional on Samhain night to leave a plate of food outside the home for the souls of the dead. A candle placed int he window guides them to the lands of eternal summer, and burying apples in the hard-packed earth "feeds" thje passed ones on their journey."


And from Janet and Stuart Farrar's A Witches Bible, "The eve of 1st November, when the Celtic Winter begins, is the dark counterpart of May Eve which greets the Summer. More than that, 1st November for the Celts was the biginning of the year itself, and the feast of Samhain was their New Year's Eve, the mysterious moment which belonged to neither past nor present, to neither this world not the Other. Sahaim is the Irish Gaelic for the month of November; Samhuin is the Scottish Gaelic for All Hallows, 1st November.

For the old pastoralists, whose herd-raising was backed by only primitive agriculture or none at all, keeping the whole herds fed through the winter was simply not possible, so the minimum breeding-stock was kept alive, and the rest were slaughtered and salted--the only way, then, of preserving meat. (hence no doubt, the traditional use in magical ritual of salt as a disinfectant' against psychic or spiritual evil). Samhain was the time when this killing and preserving was done; and it is not hard to imagine what a nervously critical occasion it was. Had the right--or enough--breeding-stock been selected? Would the coming winter be long and hard? And if so, would the breeding stock survive it, or the stored meat feed the tribe throught it?

Crops too had all to be gathered in by 31st October..."
ect ect ect.

"....Samhain, like the other pagan festivals, was so deeply rooted in popular tradition that Christianity had to try to take it over. The aspect of communion with the dead, and with other spirits, was Christianized as All Hallows, moved from its original date of 13th May (hey...? sounds like that russian folk tale time of year) to 1st November, and extended to the whole Church by Pope Gregory 4 in 834. But its pagan overtones remained uncomfortable alive, and in England the Reformation abolished All Hallows. It was not formally restored by the Church of England until 1928, "on the assumption that the old pagan associations of Hallowe'en were at last really dead and forgotten; a supposition that was certainly premature" (Doreen Valiente, an ABC of Witchcraft)

"As for the feast itself--in the banquet sense, the original food was of course a proportion of the newly slaughtered cattle, roasted in the purifying Samhain fire, and doubtless having the nature of ritually offered 'first fruits'; the fact that the priesthood had first call on it for divinatory purposes, and taht what they did not use provided a feast for the tribe, points to this. In later centuries, ritual food known as 'sowens' was consumed. Robert Burns refers to it in his poem Hallowe'en: "Till butter'd sowens, wi' fragrant lunt, Set a' their gabs a-steerin...'


......


For any dead friends whose spirits might be visiting, Irish families used to leave some tobacco and a dish of porridge--and some empty chairs--by the fire."

Happy Halloween All

Happy Hallows!

Originally Posted by Joel

Halloween ist mein Gubertstag (or is it 'bin mein Geburtstag'?)

Heute gratuliere ich dich zu dem Geburtstag!

Zum Geburtstag viel Gl

Originally Posted by Dobry

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by chaika

Notice how Christian holidays fall amazingly close to former pagan holidays. Now why would that be, do you suppose??

Halloween isn't a christian holiday!

No, no, it's not a Christian holiday. But DDT is correct about Christian holidays falling close or on the pagan holidays...the Roman Catholic church did this to facilitate the conversion of pagans into Christianity.

That's a big reason why the Virgin Mary became effectively, if not in Orthodox reality, a diety. She began to be worshipped, in order to replace the "Mother Goddess" of the pagans.

Digressing now...I've never understood the actual Catholic theological explanation of worshipping her on the same level as Christ, and treating her as THE intermediary. For me it seems to go against the grain, the spirit, of the Bible.

You may have never unstood the Catholic theological explanation for "worshipping Mary on the same level as Christ" because Catholic theology has never called for that

Danke!

Now I am legally old enough to...

-Drive a car
-Donate blood
-If I get arrested for anything they can legally post it in the news paper
-Drop out of school in some states(not here, and I don't want to anyways)
-(anything im forgetting?)

Have sex with an adult without "them" getting arrested?

Originally Posted by Joel

Danke!

Now I am legally old enough to...

-Drive a car
-Donate blood
-If I get arrested for anything they can legally post it in the news paper
-Drop out of school in some states(not here, and I don't want to anyways)
-(anything im forgetting?)

Originally Posted by Rosa Anna

Have sex with an adult without "them" getting arrested?

Woo-Hoo!!! Woo-Hoo!!! Woo-Hoo!!! ......sorry!

"Настали Святки, то-то РАДОСТЬ!" (Пушкин)

LOL! Gerty!

She is quite fetching, aren't she?

Gerty, you never cease to amaze me!

-Fantom

Now, GERTY is scaring me!

Originally Posted by challenger

Originally Posted by Dobry

Originally Posted by kalinka_vinnie

Originally Posted by chaika

Notice how Christian holidays fall amazingly close to former pagan holidays. Now why would that be, do you suppose??

Halloween isn't a christian holiday!

No, no, it's not a Christian holiday. But DDT is correct about Christian holidays falling close or on the pagan holidays...the Roman Catholic church did this to facilitate the conversion of pagans into Christianity.

That's a big reason why the Virgin Mary became effectively, if not in Orthodox reality, a diety. She began to be worshipped, in order to replace the "Mother Goddess" of the pagans.

Digressing now...I've never understood the actual Catholic theological explanation of worshipping her on the same level as Christ, and treating her as THE intermediary. For me it seems to go against the grain, the spirit, of the Bible.

You may have never unstood the Catholic theological explanation for "worshipping Mary on the same level as Christ" because Catholic theology has never called for that

(the gauntlet is thrown!)

Au contraire! Perhaps not officially in the writings of the Vatican...but in practice, Mary is dearly worshipped...and prayed to constantly as the intermediary, and diplomat of God. My phrasing may have been overboard, "on the same level", but Catholic liturgy does spend a interestingly large portion of time praying to, worshipping, and honoring Mary. This was my meaning.

Not sure why an intermediary (including the saints) is ever necessary, when you can talk directly to God, no problem. My own belief.

But, whatever...Mary did facilitate a much easier transition into Christianity for the pagans.

Gerty, nice picture! :)

Gerty - аццкий сотона!!!

"Настали Святки, то-то РАДОСТЬ!" (Пушкин)

«...И взорам адских привидений
Явилась дева...» (© он же, там же )

What's being happened to your avatars, girls and boys? Kalinka's avatar is the scariest!

no time to play with you guys

this thread is typical of Biancca,

next we will have "do russians use dental floss after or before brushing their teeths!!!"



Mordan