Thread: Russian Oligarchs

Originally Posted by Alex_krsk

Ещё менее естественно верить в подобный бред.

Хотя сам вопрос смахивает на коммунистический лозунг.

In a word that the only philosophical schools are capitalism and communism perhaps.
There are thousands of schools of thoughts supporting social justice that don't have any relation with communism.
Except if we consider communistic the systems of the Scandinavians, UK, etc where the super-rich pay extremely high income taxes in order to support a healthy social network, supporting education and social security.
Russia is ages behind regarding this specific issue.
How can one of the richest and most fearful countries of the word to have so many people living under the poverty threshold?
Except if we support Darwinism and the law of the jungle? If Abramovitz and the other guys made millions ... we shouldn't say: Congratulations you are clever and you made them. The state should ask them: How you made all this money? If it was illegally: Confiscation of wealth and immediately jail. Sounds romantic? Nope ... even Italians, one of the less organized nations in Europe, had the balls to say to Mr. Berlusconi you were not legal and you must pay. Except if you consider Russia something totally different from other European Countries, that should have rules more close to the systems of China or India?

Originally Posted by Antonio1986

How can one of the richest and most fearful countries of the word to have so many people living under the poverty threshold?

who are they people living under the poverty threshold?

I drive around the region where i live a lot. And all the ppl i see who are employed in street cleanin and stuff like that even in small towns are immigrants. When the paperwork to employ an immigrant is a pain. Who are those poor people who refuse to work for >=300 euros?

Originally Posted by Antonio1986

Except if we support Darwinism and the law of the jungle? If Abramovitz and the other guys made millions ... we shouldn't say: Congratulations you are clever and you made them. The state should ask them: How you made all this money? If it was illegally: Confiscation of wealth and immediately jail. Sounds romantic? Nope ... even Italians, one of the less organized nations in Europe, had the balls to say to Mr. Berlusconi you were not legal and you must pay. Except if you consider Russia something totally different from other European Countries, that should have rules more close to the systems of China or India?

How state can do anything with them without turning into "evil dictatorship"? Look at Khodorkovsky example. After confiscation and jail he's welcome and loved in Europe "freedom fighter" and "political prisoner". So who has what rules and who's different from what after that?

It was huge American scheme of influence in order to destroy the country in 90s. And you can't just get rid of the consequencies like in 3 or 5 years.

Originally Posted by Alex_krsk

who are they people living under the poverty threshold?

.

"There are about 5 million homeless people in Russia and of that number, 1 million are children. Studies show that Moscow has the largest share of homeless people in the country, accounting for 10,000 – 50,000 (depending on the source of information). Despite the ever growing number, there remains no social approach to the problem."

United States has better statistics but the situation is about the same.
Conclusion both Russia and USA are more close to the social systems of India, Indonesia, Phillipines etc.

Originally Posted by Antonio1986

"There are about 5 million homeless people in Russia and of that number, 1 million are children. Studies show that Moscow has the largest share of homeless people in the country, accounting for 10,000 – 50,000 (depending on the source of information). Despite the ever growing number, there remains no social approach to the problem."

Я подозреваю что это за статистика, и что это за бездомные. Несколько лет назад, когда я продал квартиру и искал другую чтобы купить, я год не имел регистрации и наверное был одним из этих пяти миллионов.
Там где я живу - физически невозможно быть реально бездомным. Ближайшая зима будет последней в твоей жизни.

Я думаю по этой статистике безработные, которые гоняют по Москве на Кайеннах и на выходные летают в Монако, тоже under the poverty threshold

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
- Mark Twain

Originally Posted by Alex_krsk

Я подозреваю что это за статистика, и что это за бездомные. Несколько лет назад, когда я продал квартиру и искал другую чтобы купить, я год не имел регистрации и наверное был одним из этих пяти миллионов.
Там где я живу - физически невозможно быть реально бездомным. Ближайшая зима будет последней в твоей жизни.

Я думаю по этой статистике безработные, которые гоняют по Москве на Кайеннах и на выходные летают в Монако, тоже under the poverty threshold

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
- Mark Twain

Никогда не понимал, почему после падения совка вы не избавились от этого позорного института регистрации...

Originally Posted by Eric C.

Никогда не понимал, почему после падения совка вы не избавились от этого позорного института регистрации...

А вы почему не избавились от него за столько лет?

Хотя мне кажется кто-то здесь путает советскую прописку с вышеупомянутой регистрацией. Но удивляться здесь нечему.

Originally Posted by Alex_krsk

А вы почему не избавились от него за столько лет?

Хотя мне кажется кто-то здесь путает советскую прописку с вышеупомянутой регистрацией. Но удивляться здесь нечему.

Во-первых, кто "мы"? =)) Где еще всем нужно в обязательном порядке уведомлять местные власти о том, где ты живешь? =))

Во-вторых, а в чем разница, кроме названия? Было: "гражданин должен быть прописан по месту жительства", стало: "гражданин должен иметь регистрацию по месту жительства".

Originally Posted by Antonio1986

In a word that the only philosophical schools are capitalism and communism perhaps.
There are thousands of schools of thoughts supporting social justice that don't have any relation with communism.
Except if we consider communistic the systems of the Scandinavians, UK, etc where the super-rich pay extremely high income taxes in order to support a healthy social network, supporting education and social security.
Russia is ages behind regarding this specific issue.
How can one of the richest and most fearful countries of the word to have so many people living under the poverty threshold?
Except if we support Darwinism and the law of the jungle? If Abramovitz and the other guys made millions ... we shouldn't say: Congratulations you are clever and you made them. The state should ask them: How you made all this money? If it was illegally: Confiscation of wealth and immediately jail. Sounds romantic? Nope ... even Italians, one of the less organized nations in Europe, had the balls to say to Mr. Berlusconi you were not legal and you must pay. Except if you consider Russia something totally different from other European Countries, that should have rules more close to the systems of China or India?

Social justice is never made through intimidating and jailing people who don't "fit". I hope any system doing so ends up like Iraq!

Speaking of how it works internally in Russia, as far as I know, after the 1990s, they suppressed a lot of political liberties, but at the same time, they try to keep the economic liberties and market values up and running. That said, as long as you only mind your business making money, and don't get into the politics, you can have as much freedom as in the States. But once you have publicly gotten political, and some of your views have been disapproved by Putin & co. , the consequences for you are undefined. The only difference between Khodorkovsky and those other oligarchs who have been well off in Russia was that the former one was trying to become a political figure, and the others never did that.

Well, at least, sure thing I can say, it could've been much worse. I just hope they in Russia don't start suppressing market liberties as you suggested. The purpose of the state is to ensure well-being for everyone, but not at the cost of others. It shouldn't "ask", "take" etc. , it should "offer", "give", and so on.