Thread: it was her who arrived first

In Irish English the reflexive pronouns 'myself', 'herself', 'himself' etc. can be used in a subject position.

Himself and his wife have always been very nice to everyone.

In other varieties of English you can sometimes find the reflexive pronoun used in subject position when it appears together with another subject - so I found these examples:

Paul and myself went there.
Only myself and my family were affected by this.

(c) bbc

Originally Posted by Sergey_

Paul and myself went there.
Only myself and my family were affected by this.

Note that this usage possibly developed from English speakers trying to avoid either "I" or "me" because they're not sure which is correct!

Young children will often use objective forms like "me", "us", "him" in a compound subject -- "Steve and me went to the playground", or "Her and Jennifer won't share their candy!" -- and then adults will correct them: "No, no, that's wrong -- you should say 'Steve and I went to the playground', and 'She and Jennifer won't share', etc."

So the kids develop a superstitious fear of the objective forms, and when they get older, they'll say things like "Would you like to have dinner with my wife and I?" And other adults may explain to them, in a polite whisper: "You mean 'dinner with my wife and me' -- because if you were to take out the words ...my wife and..., you'd say 'dinner with me', not 'dinner with I', right?"

And thus, having been corrected for using both "me" and "I", some people just make a habit of saying "myself" instead.

Originally Posted by Throbert McGee

And thus, having been corrected for using both "me" and "I", some people just make a habit of saying "myself" instead.

So using 'myself' here is grammatically incorrect, but some people say it, is that right?

Originally Posted by alexsms

So using 'myself' here is grammatically incorrect, but some people say it, is that right?

Alexms... YES. I was/am guilty of this and it wasn't until I took a course at work YEARS ago that I learned I was using "myself" incorrectly and yet, it seems so wrong to use "me."

Grammar Girl : How to Use "Myself" and Other Reflexive Pronouns :: Quick and Dirty Tips


How to Use Myself

Today's topic is how to use the word myself. Grammar Girl says that how to use myself is among the top 10 or 20 questions that people send in to the show. Here's an example:

Hi, Grammar Girl. This is Chuck Tomasi, your interim Grammar Guy from ChuckChat.com, home of podcasts too numerous to mention. I hear and see examples of the misuse of the word myself all the time. For example, an e-mail went out from HR like this, “Please contact Squiggly, Aardvark, or myself with questions.” Could you please help listeners know when the wordmyself is appropriate and when to use a more appropriate word? Thanks!

Excellent, Chuck! Let's dissect what's wrong with that sentence: "Please contact Squiggly, Aardvark, or myself with questions." (Alex and others, that is the one that gets a lot of people in trouble and is used incorrectly ALL the time.)The simplest way to think of it is like this: How would you say the sentence without Squiggly and the aardvark? Then it usually becomes obvious! You would say, “Please contact me with questions,” not, “Please contact myself with questions.” So when you add in Squiggly and the aardvark, that doesn't change anything. It's still correct to say, “Please contact Squiggly, aardvark, or me with questions.”

What are Reflexive Pronouns?

Digging into the topic a little deeper, myself is what's called a reflexive pronoun. That can be hard to remember, but just think about looking into a mirror and seeing your reflection. You'd say, “I see myself in the mirror.” You see your reflection, and myself is a reflexive pronoun.

Other reflexive pronouns include himself, herself, yourself, itself, andthemselves. A reflexive pronoun is always the object of a sentence; it can never be the subject. Grammar Girl has talked about it before, but a subject is the one doing something in a sentence, and the object is the one having something done to it. If I step on Squiggly, I am the subject and Squiggly is the object.

You would never say, “Myself stepped on Squiggly,” so you would also never say, “Aardvark and myself stepped on Squiggly.”

Another case where it is correct to use myself is when you are both the subject and the object of a sentence. For example, “I see myself playing marimbas,” or, “I'm going to treat myself to a mud bath.” In both of these cases you are the object of your own action, so myself is the right word to use.


Use Reflexive Pronouns to Add Emphasis

Reflexive pronouns can also be used to add emphasis to a sentence. (In case you care, they are then called intensive pronouns.) For example, if you had witnessed a murder, you could say, “I myself saw the madman's handiwork.” Sure, it's a tad dramatic, but it's grammatically correct. If you want to emphasize how proud you are of your new artwork, you could say, “I painted it myself.” Again, myself just adds emphasis. The meaning of the sentence doesn't change if you take out the word myself; it just has a different feeling because now it lacks the added emphasis.

There you go! The quick and dirty tip is to think about how you would write the sentence if you were the only one in it, and then use that pronoun. For example, “Please contact me.” That's where people get most hung up using myself. And then you can also remember that it's OK to use reflexive pronouns for emphasis and when you are the object of your own action.

Originally Posted by alexsms

So using 'myself' here is grammatically incorrect, but some people say it, is that right?

Well... it's technically not correct, but IMHO it's "less incorrect" (т.е., не звучит настолько безграмотно) compared to Me and my friend did this or We saw she and John kissing in the park. Which is to say that many educated speakers would not even notice the error if you said, e.g., His father and himself manage the family business -- although "His father and he manage..." is the proper form.

By the way, I would agree with the advice from "Grammar Girl" -- when you're not sure which form to use, try rephrasing the sentence to change a compound subject or object to a singular subject/object with only the pronoun: "Me did this"; "We saw she in the park"; "Himself manages the business."