Thread: MasterRussian.NET: before and after

I don't know who else is a moderator other than Lampada, but I think she's excellent.

Her moderating is completely unobtrusive as far as I can see. I think it's good that threads are allowed to "morph" into a discussion about something else sometimes.

Obviously if people are allowed to swear and be racist the forum would become too unpleasant for most peoples taste.

I don't see why curses should be filled in with stuff like $#@% - it's stupid.
I'd like to see a "mouse over topic view" feature wherein you can mouse over the topic and the first few sentences pop up allowing you a quick view of the contents or lack thereof.
I could see taking a vote on banning an individual for a period of time (not a permanent ban) if the person obviously contributes nothing but negativity.

Originally Posted by Johanna

I don't know who else is a moderator other than Lampada, but I think she's excellent. ...

It's just me, yay!

Originally Posted by Lampada

Originally Posted by Johanna

I don't know who else is a moderator other than Lampada, but I think she's excellent. ...

It's just me, yay!

That's right. I am the administrator, not moderator.

OK

Originally Posted by sperk

I tried to help a girl translate a fragment of a letter that her Russian friend had sent her only to find the topic deleted. There were no swears and nothing objectionable in the letter.

Actually, sperk, it was obviously not a letter addressed to the topic's author. First of all, why someone would write to someone in a language the addressee doesn't know? And secondly, the topic's author wrote it was his(her?) friend's letter, but in the letter's text, there was an address "sister"... It looked very much like a spying of someone else's correspondence.

Originally Posted by Оля

Originally Posted by sperk

I tried to help a girl translate a fragment of a letter that her Russian friend had sent her only to find the topic deleted. There were no swears and nothing objectionable in the letter.

Actually, sperk, it was obviously not a letter addressed to the topic's author. First of all, why someone would write to someone in a language the addressee doesn't know? And secondly, the topic's author wrote it was his(her?) friend's letter, but in the letter's text, there was an address "sister"... It looked very much like a spying of someone else's correspondence.

SO WHAT! We are here to lean another language.......not to speculate like old women and judge others' motives!

Originally Posted by DDT

SO WHAT! We are here to lean another language.......

You? You are here to lean another language? I strongly doubt that.

Originally Posted by DDT

SO WHAT! We are here to lean another language.......not to speculate like old women and judge others' motives!

It sounds rather odd though.

Helping translating a brief normal letter for a friend is one thing; helping a stranger snoop on the personal correspondence of a countryman / woman is a different one.

It certainly sounds like Sperk had been misinformed by her friend about the real nature of the letter. Perhaps Sperk should have been asked to clarify the situation before the thread was deleted.

If a stranger asked me to translate a Swedish letter that seemed to be personal and not addresssed to him/her, then I would probably just ignore the request if it was online, or ask him to explain the context if it was face-to-face.

Nothing like that has ever happened though. The only letters I have helped translate have been official letters about legal / state business that were sent out in Swedish because the sender did not realise that the recipient couldn't understand, or because a standard template had been used.

Originally Posted by Johanna

Originally Posted by DDT

SO WHAT! We are here to lean another language.......not to speculate like old women and judge others' motives!

It sounds rather odd though.

Helping translating a brief normal letter for a friend is one thing; helping a stranger snoop on the personal correspondence of a countryman / woman is a different one.

It certainly sounds like Sperk had been misinformed by her friend about the real nature of the letter. Perhaps Sperk should have been asked to clarify the situation before the thread was deleted.

If a stranger asked me to translate a Swedish letter that seemed to be personal and not addresssed to him/her, then I would probably just ignore the request if it was online, or ask him to explain the context if it was face-to-face.

Nothing like that has ever happened though. The only letters I have helped translate have been official letters about legal / state business that were sent out in Swedish because the sender did not realise that the recipient couldn't understand, or because a standard template had been used.

Well, then you don't have to translate letters if you don't want. But it is none of your business or Olyah's, if others want to help and at the same time practice their language skills. Afterall, you don't know if anyone is "spying". And if they are, what reasons they have. For all you know you are saving someone by translating. You don't know and you can't ever know. You don't know who is the good guy and who is the bad guy, period. You guys don't need to play your little speculation and judgmental games on the Internet. It's not your problem and it is not my problem. Our problem is Russian/English, and that's all. When everyone takes a stab at translating these stupid letters everyone learns just a little bit more. Every time you are rude and chase away one of these posters it is just one more poster that COULD have been a good person and COULD have stayed to contribute to the forum, thus increasing the circulation of Master Russian.

Sure. I accept your point and I am sure Olya will consider it too.

But how about if you yourself start using a bit more polite langauge when you visit here? It's clear that you have interesting information to share - I wish you could do it in a more respectful, polite way.

Since I've been a member, half of your posts (at least) are insulting towards Russia or Russian people, despite the fact that this is supposedly a langauge / country that you want to learn more about. I don't know if the non-native speakers of English pick up on this, but I surely do, and sometimes I wonder why you visit this forum if you have such a dark view on the country, its' language and its history.

Originally Posted by gRomoZeka

Originally Posted by DDT

EDIT: By The Way, I screwed up on the poll. There were only supposed to be 3 choices. The line underneath the choice with numbers are actually supposed to be explanations of the numbered choice.

You can still edit it by editing your initial post, can't you?

I think that moderation is about right. The posts and words that get edited usually are not very informative, and the gist of the message remains understandable (by now I can easily fill all the gaps in Dogboy's posts anyway. ) .

BUT I find deleting messages unacceptable. And I think that closing down topics that caused a heated discussion and a number of rude posts doesn't have sense either. It doesn't serve any purpose except.. well... ending a potentially interesting discussion.

Well, I tried fixing the POLL but I think I messed it up even worse. Now all the votes are gone and I think if you already voted you won't be able re-cast your vote, either. WE may have to make a new POLL!

Originally Posted by Johanna

Sure. I accept your point and I am sure Olya will consider it too.

But how about if you yourself start using a bit more polite langauge when you visit here? It's clear that you have interesting information to share - I wish you could do it in a more respectful, polite way.

Since I've been a member, half of your posts (at least) are insulting towards Russia or Russian people, despite the fact that this is supposedly a langauge / country that you want to learn more about. I don't know if the non-native speakers of English pick up on this, but I surely do, and sometimes I wonder why you visit this forum if you have such a dark view on the country, its' language and its history.

I don't insult Russians or Russia, and if I do the Russians are welcome to have a go back at me. We are men, not little girlies. The things that I have spoken about Russia, my Russian friends speak also. You are simply one of those girls who needs to stay in boarding school because you are too fragile for the big bad world out here! It is your two countries that I insult. Britain is a piece of doggy do-do who has thrown away it's free speech and now arrest people for "thinking" thoughts the government doesn't like, while Sweden is full of touchy-feely, sissified males who are scared to offend their New Age-Feminazi over-lords. Please, do Russia a favor and stay away from Her. We don't want Russia contaminated with your two country's over the top, self flagellating, Western-самоубийство, in the form of "Correct Politics".

Originally Posted by DDT

But it is none of your business or Olyah's, if others want to help and at the same time practice their language skills.

It's a very sharp comparison, but I'll do it: when someone comes to pilot courses and says, "I only need to learn how to fly, not to take off and not to land", you, too, don't know for sure if this man is a terrorist. And if he is, what reasons he has. You don't know and you can't ever know (well, before you really know). You don't know who is the good guy and who is the bad guy, period. And you don't need to play your little speculation and judgmental games about him.
It's not your problem. Your problem is to teach people at courses, and that's all. When everyone takes a stab at running these stupid planes everyone learns just a little bit more.
Every time you are rude and chase away one of these guys it is just one more guy that COULD have been a good person and good pilot.

As for the deleted thread, it was at least suspicious. If a friend writes to a friend, even in a language his friend doesn't understand well, even if it's just a language practice, why the second friend does not ask the first friend to translate the letter, since his Russian is not good enough yet? (although that letter did not look like a language practive AT ALL). And instead of that, he puts that quite a private correspondence on the Internet, in public? You're just blind if you don't see how the things are here, or you just argue for arguing.

And exactly, you don't know who is a good guy among them, so you shouldn't write or translate anything, exactly because of that. If the asker was "a good guy", and no one helped him, the consequences will not be as bad as they could be if he was "a bad guy".

Originally Posted by DDT

We don't want Russia contaminated with your two country's over the top, self flagellating, Western-самоубийство, in the form of "Correct Politics".

Such a charmer, you are. Whatever.
Interesting to hear that you are referring to Russia as "we".

About letters: I'm staying off the discussion about the morality of all this. This forum is not the only way a supposed-to-be-bad-guy can get the translation. Moreover, there are also private messages - nothing can prevent me from posting a private message with the translation he or she wants so badly.
So, I'll side with DDT on this (and this only) matter. We're not here to discuss morality but anyway - deleting such messages is pointless and futile.

About 'heated discussions' - Lampada is very tolerant about certain 'key words' but she acts absolutely right when things get personal. Many forums where moderators do not delete personal insults soon turn into cesspools. Such places attract trolls too. (Although, I think that every forum must have a pet troll . A tamed one preferably. )

Originally Posted by Оля

It's a very sharp comparison, but I'll do it: when someone comes to pilot courses and says, "I only need to learn how to fly, not to take off and not to land", you, too, don't know for sure if this man is a terrorist.

OK, I will not translate for Muslims then. Happy now?

Anyway, i am nor speaking of any thread that lampada may have deleted. I am not personally aware of this. I am speaking of all the fuss made by Forumers when someone wants a translation of a letter, in general.

Originally Posted by DDT

I am speaking of all the fuss made by Forumers when someone wants a translation of a letter, in general.

The forumers made a HUGE quantity of letters' translations here, on this forum, and many of those letters were very very long.