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Hi, :spin:
I'm new to learning Russian and I'm having a lot of fun. Right now my biggest challenge is pronouncing the letter "bl". If anyone has any tips that would be great! My Russian friend suggested saying the word table and isolating the sound between the b and the l, but it just isn't working for me.
Thanks for any suggestions
The muscle contraction you have to do is very similar to what you do when you are about to throw up... If you try saying "eeee" at the same time as throwing up, you got it! :thumbs:
Добрый день! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Love of Life
Hi, I remembered a moment in my life which may help you to better understand how to pronounce letter "ы".Quote:
Originally Posted by Love of Life
I used to take vocal classes and I had a need to visit phoniatrist from time to time. In order to check if vocal cords work properly a doctor forced me to do so: I needed to stretch out my tongue so as it's tip was touching my chin middle. Then (with a widely opened mouth) I needed to sing an "И" sound. And there was "Ы" as the result.
Maybe this would help you. After this try to say "Ы" without such a procedure.
Good luck!
God's Fish! What a sacrifice!
WHAT!?Quote:
Originally Posted by Love of Life
bl as in bleach? :lol: Surely she wouldn't be talking about the ь and the Ukrainian i...Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
No seriously, this isn't two letters. It's one. It's no different than a "r" or a "w" -- just one sound. If you make a kind of grunt while you say "eee" you've got it. It's best to try to find some recordings -- check out the audio section of this forum...
http://masterrussian.net/mforum/viewforum.php?f=45
[quote=Бармалей][quote=TATY][quote="Love of Life":nqw6p8ag]and isolating the sound between the b and the l, but
Thanks for any suggestions[/quote]
WHAT!?[/quote]
bl as in bleach? :lol: Surely she wouldn't be talking about the ь and the Ukrainian i...
No seriously, this isn't two letters. It's one. It's no different than a "r" or a "w" -- just one sound. If you make a kind of grunt while you say "eee" you've got it. It's best to try to find some recordings -- check out the audio section of this forum...
[url="http://masterrussian.net/mforum/viewforum.php?f=45"]http://masterrussian.net/mforum/viewforum.php?f=45[/url][/quote:nqw6p8ag]
Now it is one letter, but it originates from two letters (but with one sound)
ЪІ ----> Ы
But back to the original poster's comments. Ь has not sound of it's own, so one can't isolate the sound between it and I. And I doesn't even exist in Russian. Tell this friend they are talking crap.
Even more one case:Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
ЪИ ----> Ы
Yes, except at the time, И looked more like Н. In Greek there is an I ("ee")sound represented by the letter Н. As in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eta_%28letter%29Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowik
In Cyrillic, the bar of Н began to slant and eventually have the modern form И
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Mele ... phabet.PNG
In this picture above you can still see И has a horrizontal bar, just slightly left slanting bar.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Pove ... t_text.PNG
In this example И has a very slight left slant, whereas Н has a very slight right slant.
Russian Н came from the Greek N, but this time the bar went from being slanted to horrizontal.
It is not real image from old book. Only stylization.Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
Old cyrillic books have no spaces between words.
http://knigorod.raspopin.ru/gallery/vie ... =letopis_1
Real scans of one old hand-written copy of "Povest_vremennykh_let" are available on the page http://radzivil.chat.ru
http://radzivil.chat.ru/p7o.jpg
http://radzivil.chat.ru/p10.jpg
http://radzivil.chat.ru/p10o.jpg
and so on
Wiki:
Letter Ы, old name is Yery (Еры) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yery
Sound Ы http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Close_cent ... nded_vowel
Read his sentence again.
Quote:
My Russian friend suggested saying the word table and isolating the sound between the b and the l, but it just isn't working for me.
Oh, that should have been:Quote:
Originally Posted by basurero
saying the word 'table'.
Because I thought he meant table of words of something.
The sound between the B and L in Table is more of a schwa which is not Ы.
It is the sound represented by Ъ in the Bulgarian language
e.g. Български
Until you get a real live tutor (preferably native speaker of Russian) the vowel sounds a lot like the vowel in standard American English word bill, bit, sit, lit, hit, kit, and etc. But it is not an exact match, and as someone was describing, you as a new learner will have to reach into your mouth and pull both sides of it sideways toward your ears. (am I serious here? damn straight!)
But anyway, that would make it sound a little bit more like the Russian Ы. Get yourself a native speaker tutor (did I mention that?)
ROFL.
Native speakers: that would be ВНПС in Russian, wouldn't it?
PS I had to preview this before posting, but I think i will let it go anyway. в пути!
ВНПС - Внутригосударственные небанковские платежные системы?
Domestic Non-Bank Payment System!?!Quote:
Originally Posted by Lampada
или (из sokr.ru):
Востокнефтепроводстрой
Уфа
:lol:
what's that -- cash transfers under the table? =:^0
I think Bulgarian Ъ is more closer to short О or У then Ы.Quote:
Originally Posted by TATY
So България transcripted as Bulgaria in Western languages and as Болгария in Russian.
No, I didn't say Ъ was like Ы, I said Ы was originally ЪІ.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wowik
In Bulgarian, Ъ is like a schwa (Шва по-русски):
http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A8%D0%B2%D0%B0