Quote Originally Posted by Crocodile View Post
Sure, so try and ask Wikipedia why is that 'equal say' part is not working. I can only answer for myself, I can't defend Wikipedia. I gave you my definition of democracy that makes it different from the other forms of government we see today and I'm ready to discuss the pros and cons of it. Your complaint should be addressed to Wikipedia - why is that the definition of the democracy they provide is different from what we see today.
We're dealing with two different definitions here. You advocate your own one while I'm pointing out that this is not the kind of definition 'democtatic leaders' use. You can explain all kind of contraversities with clever words and smart definitions, but again - your explanation does not fit the idea of democracy the most of people have in their heads.

Quote Originally Posted by Crocodile View Post
That's what they call the power, my young padawan learner. Remember, I mentioned the approach is child-safe? What do you do with a child that behaves very bad and does not respond to either of the finely-refined pedagogy? You slap his butt, and when he starts crying you tell him to behave well. If he still goes on, you slap harder. But here's another option: do not bother that pedagogy which veils and obscures the truth - as soon as a child starts behaving bad, slap his butt with all your honesty so he falls down to the floor. (I saw that happening, by the way.) Can you tell some pros and cons in those two approaches? No sophistry, remember?
Well, from the humanitarian point of view I would agree, that beating children without explaining a few things before that is bad, but in the long run, I don't think there will be any difference when that child grows up. Yes, those two hypothetical kids would have different characters and will act differently, but the 'beaten one' would probably have better sense. Having said so, I must admit that this is a pure speculation and if we assume that in this example by saying 'parent' we mean 'government' and by 'child' we mean 'the subjects' then the allusion is wrong. A parent gives life to its offspring and he provides for his offspring therefore he can be at least partially justified while in the government/subjects pair the situaion is the opposite. It's the subjects who feed their government and it's the subjects who 'gave birth' to the government.

So, if we have a dictator who ascended the power by violence and mistreats his population will be overthrown sooner or later and there will be a new system of state power, but in a 'democratic country' it doesn't matter who currently the president is because the system won't change. A new president will continue to maintain the current system and lie on TV about 'equal rights and possibilities'.

Well, now, that's why I'm against any forms of government.


Quote Originally Posted by Crocodile View Post
Have you ever been to the US?
I have. Twice, but I'm not in a position to judge basing on my own experience. Simply because of I had not witnessed any committed crimes this doesn't mean that the Americans are all that law-abiding. If that were so, US wouldn't have had the largest prison population in the world and a crime statistics worse than it is in some less democratic countries.