Self: сам & себя

Ok, in response to Doninphxaz's point I started a new thread - I need a more thorough explanation anyway.

So, as far as I see it you use себя when you are the both the subject and the object of the sentence. So: она говорила о себе. This makes sense, and you can obviously use себя in much the same way with any of the other cases (excluding the nominative).

But I can't really understand where сам fits in... I've been told that it effectively means "by oneself" or "on (my) own", but then wouldn't с собой mean the same thing?

If not, I can appreciate when you'd use сам сама само сами, but when would you use all the other cases (i.e. самого самой самим самому самых etc) in a sentence? I think I just need a few examples and then I'll understand because I had a similar problem with all the весь words but seeing how they were used really helped.

Thank you.

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Originally Posted by happyclogs

Ok, in response to Doninphxaz's point I started a new thread - I need a more thorough explanation anyway.

So, as far as I see it you use себя when you are the both the subject and the object of the sentence. So: она говорила о себе. This makes sense, and you can obviously use себя in much the same way with any of the other cases (excluding the nominative).

But I can't really understand where сам fits in... I've been told that it effectively means "by oneself" or "on (my) own", but then wouldn't с собой mean the same thing?

If not, I can appreciate when you'd use сам сама само сами, but when would you use all the other cases (i.e. самого самой самим самому самых etc) in a sentence? I think I just need a few examples and then I'll understand because I had a similar problem with all the весь words but seeing how they were used really helped.

Thank you.

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"С собой" is rather a different thing... It means "With oneself(literally)" - Example: Я взял своё ружьё с собой - I took my gun along
1) Ей пришлось самой идти туда - She had to go there by herself...
2)Он вредит самому себе.. - He harms himself
3)Вам нужно перестать врать самим себе - You should stop lying to yourselves.
4)Он не слышит самого себя He can't hear himself
5) Самых - has nothing common with all the previous... It's used for forming the superlatives...
For example: Это - одно из самых красивых зданих в мире - This is one of the most beautiful buildings in the world...

Ah, Ok...

I always thought that in those examples -
2)Он вредит самому себе.. - He harms himself
3)Вам нужно перестать врать самим себе - You should stop lying to yourselves.
4)Он не слышит самого себя He can't hear himself
- you would only use себе (or whatever case ending) by itself. So: Он вредит себе - He harms himself. Is that not correct? What does the самому add to the meaning; is it necessary?

Also could you explain
1) Ей пришлось самой идти туда - She had to go there by herself...
What case is the samoi in? I don't really understand this one...

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Originally Posted by happyclogs

Ah, Ok...

I always thought that in those examples -
2)Он вредит самому себе.. - He harms himself
3)Вам нужно перестать врать самим себе - You should stop lying to yourselves.
4)Он не слышит самого себя He can't hear himself
- you would only use себе (or whatever case ending) by itself. So: Он вредит себе - He harms himself. Is that not correct? What does the самому add to the meaning; is it necessary?

Also could you explain
1) Ей пришлось самой идти туда - She had to go there by herself...
What case is the samoi in? I don't really understand this one...

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Он вредит себе - is correct as well.. But in this case we use "самому" in order to emphasize that not anybody else by HE harms himself.
"Cамой' - means "by herself...
Ей пришлось самой сделать это упражнение - She had to do this exercise on her own...