Some Starter Questions

Hi Everyone,
just wondering as a beginner to learning russian, if someone would be so kind to answer some questions for me.

is it possible to learn to read and write russian without the being able to speak it? as i do not know anyone who speaks russian but have an interest in being able to read and write it.

when trying to translate russian words to english just using the alphabet, most of the words that i translate come out nothing like they should is this me or is there something i am missing?

whats the best ways to learn online as i ride the train to and from work so i have 2+ hours a day free on there and would like to use that time to help improve my knowlage. i have a program for my phone that uses flashcards, and i have a listing of the alphabet.

thanks
Kris

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Originally Posted by kristiaan_d

Hi Everyone,
just wondering as a beginner to learning russian, if someone would be so kind to answer some questions for me.

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I'm just another Russian student, but I can give you my opinions.

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is it possible to learn to read and write russian without the being able to speak it? as i do not know anyone who speaks russian but have an interest in being able to read and write it.

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Why not? People do this all the time with ancient languages. Keep in mind it is not ideal and will really hamper you if you ever want to actually speak to someone in Russian. There are plenty of strange things in Russian pronunciation that require some practice if you want to speak or listen at some point. If your only goal is to be able to translate texts, then you should be fine.

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when trying to translate russian words to english just using the alphabet, most of the words that i translate come out nothing like they should is this me or is there something i am missing?

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Not sure what you mean by this. Perhaps some of this has to do with the specifics of Russian pronunciation patterns? Not sure what you mean by translating using the alphabet. I think most people use a dictionary for that purpose. Also, for what it's worth, using a Russian-English dictionary will probably be frustrating at first, but keep at it.

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whats the best ways to learn online as i ride the train to and from work so i have 2+ hours a day free on there and would like to use that time to help improve my knowlage. i have a program for my phone that uses flashcards, and i have a listing of the alphabet.

thanks
Kris

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Easy. Get a textbook and a small notebook and pen. Do all of the exercises in your textbook. There are plenty out there. The only one I'd really tell you to avoid is the Russian for Dummies just due to the fact that the publisher decided to remove all of the cyrillic script and replace it with transliterations.

In any event, you won't do very well just by reading alone. Write things out yourself. Copy out the sample sentences. You are in a perfect situation to do one of the beginning audio courses as well, even though you say you only want reading and writing.

Also, if it is practical for you, there is a whole college level Russian course online. Look in the forum for stuff about the "Princeton Course".

hi Paul thanks for the info it was clear and to the point, appollgies about the dixtonary question I will try and explain it better. I was under the impression that if I took the Russian word, and took it letter for letter in the Russian alphabet and the wrote down its English letter alternative I would get the English word but as I have found out that's not the case

For example the Russian word for cafe translates well using the rissian alphabet but the Russian word for radiation using the same principle does not , when I get in I will try and post a better example using my phone todo this and its hard work LOL

Anyway again thanks for the info in the reply it made a lot of sense

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Originally Posted by kristiaan_d

if I took the Russian word, and took it letter for letter in the Russian alphabet and the wrote down its English letter alternative I would get the English word but as I have found out that's not the case

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Are you serious?! I'm sorry, I don't mean to be mean but that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Do you not see that that would mean that Russian and English are the same languages with the same words, just written with a different alphabet. How old are you? Do you not understand that the whole point of different languages is that they use DIFFERENT WORDS, THAT SOUND DIFFERENT. Have you never heard a foreign language before? Have you not heard that the words are not the same as English. Why would Russian words be the same as English words?

Clearly your understanding of language is so non-existant, that you are never going to be ever deal with a complex language like Russian.

you mean Dostoprimechatelnost' isn't an English word? DAMMIT!

Thanks for the constructive relpy, nice to see everyone is as helpful as Paul around here, certain simple words I have found have translated fine so I wondered if this was the Case with most of the words as it would make learning them easier for me.

Would you have any constructive words to help out or do you spend most of your time laughing at people willing to learn but having no clue where to start?

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Originally Posted by TATY

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Originally Posted by kristiaan_d

if I took the Russian word, and took it letter for letter in the Russian alphabet and the wrote down its English letter alternative I would get the English word but as I have found out that's not the case

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Are you serious?! I'm sorry, I don't mean to be mean but that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Do you not see that that would mean that Russian and English are the same languages with the same words, just written with a different alphabet. How old are you? Do you not understand that the whole point of different languages is that they use DIFFERENT WORDS, THAT SOUND DIFFERENT. Have you never heard a foreign language before? Have you not heard that the words are not the same as English. Why would Russian words be the same as English words?

Clearly your understanding of language is so non-existant, that you are never going to be ever deal with a complex language like Russian.

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some words are the same, most aren't. if you're serious and dont know much about language learning, start small. try russian in three months (i know what it sounds like) and see how you get on. it's all laid out in a simple format.

kristiaan_d, some words do indeed sound exactly the same or with only slight difference from their English counterpart. It's because these words are NOT Russian. They're called 'borrowed' words from other languages. There are many words in English and in Russian that came from Latin or Greek, so they're bound to sound (or to be written) similarly.
Moreover, English and Russian have some common roots and they're much closer to each other than, say, English and Arabic.

That's why you'll stumble upon some familiar words while learning Russian. Still, there are also many borrowings in Russian from German, French, Arabic even whilt there are words that have original Russian stems.

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Originally Posted by kristiaan_d

...Would you have any constructive words to help out ... ?

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He would and very much so. You'll see.

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Originally Posted by TATY

Clearly your understanding of language is so non-existent.

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Wow, the irony is overwhelming.

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Originally Posted by Lt. Columbo

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Originally Posted by TATY

Clearly your understanding of language is so non-existent.

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Wow, the irony is overwhelming.

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Yeh, such irony that in response to someone who thought that Russian was just English written in another alphabet I made one simple typo.

It's not ironic because firstly I was not criticising anyone's spelling, and secondly having "no understanding of language" is nothing to do with being able to spell.

So clearly you are easily overwhelmed because that really wasn't ironic in the slightest.

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Originally Posted by TATY

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Originally Posted by Lt. Columbo

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Originally Posted by TATY

Clearly your understanding of language is so non-existent.

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Wow, the irony is overwhelming.

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Yeh, such irony that in response to someone who thought that Russian was just English written in another alphabet I made one simple typo.

It's not ironic because firstly I was not criticising anyone's spelling, and secondly having "no understanding of language" is nothing to do with being able to spell.

So clearly you are easily overwhelmed because that really wasn't ironic in the slightest.

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I agree with TATY on this one, and Lt. Columbo- if a simple typo or misspelling can be forgiven for a native speaker, can't it be for someone who isn't? You can understand what TATY is writing, can't you?

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Originally Posted by strawberryfynch

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Originally Posted by TATY

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Originally Posted by Lt. Columbo

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Originally Posted by TATY

Clearly your understanding of language is so non-existent.

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Wow, the irony is overwhelming.

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Yeh, such irony that in response to someone who thought that Russian was just English written in another alphabet I made one simple typo.

It's not ironic because firstly I was not criticising anyone's spelling, and secondly having "no understanding of language" is nothing to do with being able to spell.

So clearly you are easily overwhelmed because that really wasn't ironic in the slightest.

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I agree with TATY on this one, and Lt. Columbo- if a simple typo or misspelling can be forgiven for a native speaker, can't it be for someone who isn't? You can understand what TATY is writing, can't you?

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I am a native English speaker, but still a typo is just a typo, I know how to spell 'existent', I just didn't spell it correctly in that instance. Also, considering the fact that "understanding of language" means the concept of language, i.e. what language is on a very basic level, it has nothing to do with English spelling.

If I'd have said "your knowledge of English spelling is non-existant", then it'd have been ironic.

Actually that was me who posted the correction. I was posting from Lt. Columbo's computer (I'm in Moscow right now), and his account was already logged in but I couldn't bother switching accounts so I made a post under his name.

So don't take it out on him. He's a good guy.

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Originally Posted by Yazeed

Actually that was me who posted the correction. I was posting from Lt. Columbo's computer (I'm in Moscow right now), and his account was already logged in but I couldn't bother switching accounts so I made a post under his name.

So don't take it out on him. He's a good guy.

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OK, I blame you :twisted:

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Originally Posted by TATY

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Originally Posted by Yazeed

Actually that was me who posted the correction. I was posting from Lt. Columbo's computer (I'm in Moscow right now), and his account was already logged in but I couldn't bother switching accounts so I made a post under his name.

So don't take it out on him. He's a good guy.

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OK, I blame you :twisted:

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I'm sorry TATY. :oops:

I'm not sorry. I know about your secret Norwegian identity... bahahah "Native English speaker".

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Originally Posted by Dogboy182

I'm not sorry. I know about your secret Norwegian identity... bahahah "Native English speaker".

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You're mistaking him with kalinka_vinnie

By the way! WHo ate Kalinka? He hasn't made a single appearance since this winter! :cry:

it was VM i believe

He shoudln't have married... He lost his roots. :evil: :twisted: :lol:

Is it possible to do the opposite? I want to be able to speak and pronounce and have a full conversation speak fluently and all. But I don't neccessarily want to know how to read it.

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Originally Posted by Ettinger

Is it possible to do the opposite? I want to be able to speak and pronounce and have a full conversation speak fluently and all. But I don't neccessarily want to know how to read it.

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I'm sure it's possible, but what's the point? You'll miss a lot and it's not practical (you wouldn't be able to read the signs, etc.)

Reading in Russian is relatively easy, all you need to do is to learn an alphabet (33 letters, some of them the same as in English - a couple of days of work, at most) and a few rules (or at least the major one, about 'o' and 'и' sounding different in stressed/unstressed position).

PS. An easy and fun way to learn Russian alphabet (by the courtesy of Dogboy 182 :)):
http://www.langintro.com/rintro/first.htm

dude, that's just stupid. are you going to write down all your new words in translit?
sit down and learn the alphabet. it will take like a day and you'll be thankful you did

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Originally Posted by Ettinger

Is it possible to do the opposite? I want to be able to speak and pronounce and have a full conversation speak fluently and all. But I don't neccessarily want to know how to read it.

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So no dictionaries, no online materials of any kind except audio, no homework ( no read -> no write ), just talk to teacher from time to time and listen to tapes? Sounds scary, like rosetta stone.